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chipc3

Interesting Topic about JJJ

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1 hour ago, Lugan Village said:

the thing about identifying upside potential is hard – for JJJ he seems to bring the technical, physical, and psychological aspects...BUT sometimes, the coach and the org just have to go with your gut instinct.  JJJ can fulfill his potential but that doesn’t always mean being a star. It means figuring out what is JJJ role is and being the best at that role.   For our Grizz, we need a star at the 4...is it JJJ?

What we need isn't always what we get, we've never had a star at any position, more so just good players or really good ones. 

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It’s a risk to trade any player for someone another team didn’t want as much as they wanted your player. The question boils down to do you believe the FO is competent enough to improve the team with the risk or not?

Personally I don’t see Lavine as a team killer and I love the idea of a player’s coach like Taylor getting an Uber-talented young player. Not thst Jackson isn’t talented as well but he isn’t a ball dominant player who can create his own shots down the stretch. Morant can do this. Brooks believes he can although I believe most people on the boards don’t agree. Having two players who can create their own offense is needed in today’s game. 

Consider assists. Lavine averaged 4.2 APG last season despite being the lead scorer on the Bulls roster. Dillon Brooks and Jaren Jackson combined averaged 3.5 APG last season. In Taylor’s offense passing is needed to spread the court. Lavine and Morant could be better suited in Taylor’s offense as willing passers. 

This is just an idea but imagine a lineup with Morant, Lavine, Anderson, Clarke and JV. That’s three good to greet passers, two solid rebounders, perimeter shooting would be a question but Morant may improve and Anderson showed growth in the bubble. You’d still have Dillon Brooks, Allen, Dieng and Tolliver who can stretch the court coming off the bench plus the fourth pick in the draft who could be a SF like Deni Avidjia or a PF like Obi Toppin. 

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1 hour ago, chipc3 said:

It’s a risk to trade any player for someone another team didn’t want as much as they wanted your player. The question boils down to do you believe the FO is competent enough to improve the team with the risk or not?

Personally I don’t see Lavine as a team killer and I love the idea of a player’s coach like Taylor getting an Uber-talented young player. Not thst Jackson isn’t talented as well but he isn’t a ball dominant player who can create his own shots down the stretch. Morant can do this. Brooks believes he can although I believe most people on the boards don’t agree. Having two players who can create their own offense is needed in today’s game. 

Consider assists. Lavine averaged 4.2 APG last season despite being the lead scorer on the Bulls roster. Dillon Brooks and Jaren Jackson combined averaged 3.5 APG last season. In Taylor’s offense passing is needed to spread the court. Lavine and Morant could be better suited in Taylor’s offense as willing passers. 

This is just an idea but imagine a lineup with Morant, Lavine, Anderson, Clarke and JV. That’s three good to greet passers, two solid rebounders, perimeter shooting would be a question but Morant may improve and Anderson showed growth in the bubble. You’d still have Dillon Brooks, Allen, Dieng and Tolliver who can stretch the court coming off the bench plus the fourth pick in the draft who could be a SF like Deni Avidjia or a PF like Obi Toppin. 

I like the lineup, makes sense except for BC....I seem him as an exceptionally valuable 6th...he can still get 25-30 minutes a game, but he excels in a 2nd rotation...and when someone goes down can fill in.....

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Lavine is just an athletic Kevin Martin. 

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2 hours ago, Lugan Village said:

Developing all the young guys together is not the model that works...I've said from my earliest posts that at least one or maybe 2 of our top 3 young guys (JA, JJJ, Clarke) will not be with our team in 3 years...if you take the Raptors top picks over the years that were legit NBA starters/or key rotational players like...JV, Ross, Bruno, Poitl, Wright, Davis ...they were all traded for what Raptors thought they needed to improve....Lowry, Gasol, Ibaka for example...  I am not wedded to anyone that we draft if it means improving the team...so JJJ needs to be a star at the 4 position...whereas we need an all star shooter at 2 or 3.  If JJJ will develop "SOON" into a perennial all star then no issues. 

It worked for GS

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2 hours ago, chipc3 said:

It’s a risk to trade any player for someone another team didn’t want as much as they wanted your player. The question boils down to do you believe the FO is competent enough to improve the team with the risk or not?

Personally I don’t see Lavine as a team killer and I love the idea of a player’s coach like Taylor getting an Uber-talented young player. Not thst Jackson isn’t talented as well but he isn’t a ball dominant player who can create his own shots down the stretch. Morant can do this. Brooks believes he can although I believe most people on the boards don’t agree. Having two players who can create their own offense is needed in today’s game. 

Consider assists. Lavine averaged 4.2 APG last season despite being the lead scorer on the Bulls roster. Dillon Brooks and Jaren Jackson combined averaged 3.5 APG last season. In Taylor’s offense passing is needed to spread the court. Lavine and Morant could be better suited in Taylor’s offense as willing passers. 

This is just an idea but imagine a lineup with Morant, Lavine, Anderson, Clarke and JV. That’s three good to greet passers, two solid rebounders, perimeter shooting would be a question but Morant may improve and Anderson showed growth in the bubble. You’d still have Dillon Brooks, Allen, Dieng and Tolliver who can stretch the court coming off the bench plus the fourth pick in the draft who could be a SF like Deni Avidjia or a PF like Obi Toppin. 

If rather go after him in free agency than give up our second best player with hands down the most potential to grow

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2 hours ago, chipc3 said:

It’s a risk to trade any player for someone another team didn’t want as much as they wanted your player. The question boils down to do you believe the FO is competent enough to improve the team with the risk or not?

Personally I don’t see Lavine as a team killer and I love the idea of a player’s coach like Taylor getting an Uber-talented young player. Not thst Jackson isn’t talented as well but he isn’t a ball dominant player who can create his own shots down the stretch. Morant can do this. Brooks believes he can although I believe most people on the boards don’t agree. Having two players who can create their own offense is needed in today’s game. 

Consider assists. Lavine averaged 4.2 APG last season despite being the lead scorer on the Bulls roster. Dillon Brooks and Jaren Jackson combined averaged 3.5 APG last season. In Taylor’s offense passing is needed to spread the court. Lavine and Morant could be better suited in Taylor’s offense as willing passers. 

This is just an idea but imagine a lineup with Morant, Lavine, Anderson, Clarke and JV. That’s three good to greet passers, two solid rebounders, perimeter shooting would be a question but Morant may improve and Anderson showed growth in the bubble. You’d still have Dillon Brooks, Allen, Dieng and Tolliver who can stretch the court coming off the bench plus the fourth pick in the draft who could be a SF like Deni Avidjia or a PF like Obi Toppin. 

Yes he can

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5 minutes ago, toocoolkellz said:

It worked for GS

Only Steph and Green were draft picks...the rest were FA or trades...like i said, likely two of Ja, JJJ, Clarke will be gone within 2 years...Im betting that JA stays...he is the franchise.

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5 minutes ago, Lugan Village said:

Only Steph and Green were draft picks...the rest were FA or trades...like i said, likely two of Ja, JJJ, Clarke will be gone within 2 years...Im betting that JA stays...he is the franchise.

They drafted Klay Thompson.

Curry, Thompson, and Green were the core of their first championship and grew together after being drafted by Golden State. If they had traded away any of the three their dynasty never happens.

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45 minutes ago, Lugan Village said:

I like the lineup, makes sense except for BC....I seem him as an exceptionally valuable 6th...he can still get 25-30 minutes a game, but he excels in a 2nd rotation...and when someone goes down can fill in.....

I agree with regards to BC. BC and JV have already shown they do not play well together, BC would need to expand his game for any lineup featuring him and JV on the floor together to work. If JJJ is traded we better hope Porter pans out, he sounds like he would be a better fit to play alongside either one of them, similar to how JJJ can play well with both JV and BC.

I don't like the rest of the lineup either. Not enough shooting, poor PnR defense, redundant backcourt players.

Trading JJJ, keeping JV in the starting lineup, inserting Anderson...…..to me that's moving backwards, not forwards.

And so what if we get the #4 pick, this is a weak draft where people have a hard time even identifying a player worthy of the number 1 pick much less the 4th. Obi Toppin is projected as a top 5 pick in this draft, he plays perimeter defense about as well as JV and for someone who is 6'9 and an amazing athlete he also blocks a surprisingly low amount of shots, so he's not a rim protector and he cannot switch and defend on the perimeter. He is a great finisher around the basket but that's about it.

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15 minutes ago, toocoolkellz said:

If rather go after him in free agency than give up our second best player with hands down the most potential to grow

Not if you had some strange axe to grind with JJJ.

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Who are we trying to trade [edit: I meant build but I guess that’s a Freudian slip ... so who do we build/trade/draft] around?  Jaren Jackson or Ja Morant?  A guy like Zach LaVine could complement both.  Not a lot of guys like that though.  If we were drafting at the top this year (or traded into it) a guy like Wiseman would be a perfect fit for Ja Morant.  A player like Deni Avdija would be a better fit for JJJ.  ... an ideal guard to complement Jaren might be someone like Tyrese Halliburton — although maybe not the guy to put next to Ja.  

I like a lot of players on our team, like Clarke, Jonas, even Dillon and Kyle, and I am interested in seeing how Winslow pans out — but it I can get a Ja/Jaren/Wiseman/Deni four man mega core then I am going all in.  

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24 minutes ago, Allen said:

Lavine is just an athletic Kevin Martin. 

I remember one time a team traded away a future MVP for Kevin Martin, I sure would hate to see the Grizzlies pull a move like that.

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26 minutes ago, Lugan Village said:

Only Steph and Green were draft picks...the rest were FA or trades...like i said, likely two of Ja, JJJ, Clarke will be gone within 2 years...Im betting that JA stays...he is the franchise.

You mean steph, klay and green

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I forgot about Klay...so they did have 3 core guys that were drafted.  You could make the argument that Durant was the most critical piece of their starting 5, like Leonard was to the Raptors in his only year with them.  Let me suggest that I would be disappointed if FO stood still between now and beginning of next season whenever that is.  But maybe best window is after the draft, accumulate another asset, and see what options then exist....I don't think we can afford to be inactive, even in year 2 of a rebuild.

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1 minute ago, Lugan Village said:

I forgot about Klay...so they did have 3 core guys that were drafted.  You could make the argument that Durant was the most critical piece of their starting 5, like Leonard was to the Raptors in his only year with them.  Let me suggest that I would be disappointed if FO stood still between now and beginning of next season whenever that is.  But maybe best window is after the draft, accumulate another asset, and see what options then exist....I don't think we can afford to be inactive, even in year 2 of a rebuild.

Durant didn't even join the team until after they had won a championship, and would he ever even have signed with Golden State if the other three were not already there?

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2 minutes ago, Lugan Village said:

I forgot about Klay...so they did have 3 core guys that were drafted.  You could make the argument that Durant was the most critical piece of their starting 5, like Leonard was to the Raptors in his only year with them.  Let me suggest that I would be disappointed if FO stood still between now and beginning of next season whenever that is.  But maybe best window is after the draft, accumulate another asset, and see what options then exist....I don't think we can afford to be inactive, even in year 2 of a rebuild.

Yeah. Lets make a deal for a mediocore player that will get us on the treadmill. Or we can take our lumps next year , have internal growth, and go into the 2021 draft and look to make our move for someone who can make a difference.

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2 minutes ago, KyleB said:

Durant didn't even join the team until after they had won a championship, and would he ever even have signed with Golden State if the other three were not already there?

hmmm..what are the prospects that Memphis is attractive enough of an option vs eg. Golden State in almost any scenario to attract a legit star in FA?  Memphis needs to draft and trade...ain't no FA coming to Graceland...it's like Toronto...they had to put assets together to get Kawhi..and he was one year and gone. 

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I will admit that I wasn't a fan of JJJ on draft night but he quickly won me over.  Giving up a young player who is definitely talented and as so much room to grow is beyond me. If he develops into a 20+ per game and 6 to 8 rebounds he's definitely a keeper and not fa off from that mark. He may not ever be a great rebounder but he does provide help in other aspects

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4 minutes ago, Crizzle said:

Yeah. Lets make a deal for a mediocore player that will get us on the treadmill. Or we can take our lumps next year , have internal growth, and go into the 2021 draft and look to make our move for someone who can make a difference.

who said anything about giving up JJJ for a mediocre player?  The timing for when you make a move might be more what u suggest...but I would entertain any GM calls on JJJ...

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3 minutes ago, Lugan Village said:

hmmm..what are the prospects that Memphis is attractive enough of an option vs eg. Golden State in almost any scenario to attract a legit star in FA?  Memphis needs to draft and trade...ain't no FA coming to Graceland...it's like Toronto...they had to put assets together to get Kawhi..and he was one year and gone. 

3 to 4 years from now we will still be a relatively young team while some teams will be relatively old. 

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1 minute ago, toocoolkellz said:

I will admit that I wasn't a fan of JJJ on draft night but he quickly won me over.  Giving up a young player who is definitely talented and as so much room to grow is beyond me. If he develops into a 20+ per game and 6 to 8 rebounds he's definitely a keeper and not fa off from that mark. He may not ever be a great rebounder but he does provide help in other aspects

20 and 6 is a good player...are we settling on that is what we need from him to be the 2nd wheel behind JA?  Heck DeMar D. was ave 24, 6 assists, 6 rebounds, PER of 22 and an all star...and they traded the franchise to get the "one"....just saying

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2 minutes ago, Lugan Village said:

hmmm..what are the prospects that Memphis is attractive enough of an option vs eg. Golden State in almost any scenario to attract a legit star in FA?  Memphis needs to draft and trade...ain't no FA coming to Graceland...it's like Toronto...they had to put assets together to get Kawhi..and he was one year and gone. 

The stars were not exactly flocking to Golden State either before they won a championship. Andre Iguodala was their biggest free agent signing prior to Durant, I've never thought of him as a star. Name me one legit star not named Durant who has signed with Golden State as a free agent.

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