ALT GRIND

The NEW official 2020 Draft Thread

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This is the NEW official 2020 draft thread... I guess the old one self-quarantined.  

At the top of the draft James Wiseman looks as good as anybody (as far as center prospects have gone -- historically speaking).  NBA Draft Room likes him.  Sticking with my prediction from June 2018 I still think he is a poor man's version of Mitchell Robinson.  ... I think Wiseman will be better/more well rounded on offense.  Different build and athleticism but both Wiseman and Mitch Rob are well-built with good athleticism.  Mitch Rob probably being the better leaper and pick/roll guy with Wiseman having more upside as a trailer, or maybe a big man with grab-go potential.  Probably not in the Kareem/Wilt/Hakeem level of pantheon centers but I can see him showing some flashes of Nate Thurmond, Bill Walton, David Robinson, and Greg Oden.  

Deni Avdija looks promising.  Upside.  Maybe his FLOOR is Dario Saric which might not be a bad floor for a guy in the 3-5 range although maybe you don't get AS MUCH value at 2.

Tyrese Haliburton is a good player.  He might be the better Money Ball pick (at least in terms of value) over LaMelo Ball.

Amar Sylla looks interesting.  He isn't supposed to go high, but he has been on the radar awhile and could really move up.  Between him and Onyeka Okongwu they might be the top two second tier centers/bigs in this draft.

I like Markus Howard.  I usually have him around 7 or 8 in my internal big boards.  The kid can shoot and score.

Precious Achiuwa is an interesting player.  In the WRONG system he could be a relative disappointment.  In the RIGHT SYSTEM he could be a break out star.  He could probably end up going anywhere in the top five to somewhere in the mid/late first round.  

My DEEP SLEEPER picks include Matt Mitchell from SDSU and Antwann Jones.  Antwann Jones is going to transfer to Creighton so I don't think he comes out, but who knows.  At this point I have him around 8 usually just after Markus Howard.  Matt Mitchell is a guy I had at 1 at some point, now I have him closer to 5.  

Obi Toppin looks like the Boom/Bust "NAME" guy in this draft.  If he is the top "mocked player" on the board I would consider trading DOWN if he didn't impress me in the draft workouts.  

Other than that, I am relatively higher on Scottie Lewis and Isaiah Joe.  I am relatively LOWER on LaMelo Ball and Anthony Edwards.  

I have Mason Jones at 26 which is another deep sleeper for me.  He's a guy who can just put points on the board. 

As far as my second round goes, I think these guys can be underrated rotation/utility players on the next level: Jay Huff, Jericho Sims, Shareef O'Neal, Kahlil Whitney, Scotty Pippen, Jr., Malcolm Dandridge, N'faly Dante, Jarron Cumberland, Mac McClung, and John Fulkerson.

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I am going to keep taunting the NBA with the coming arrival of my Mother Of All Big Boards Virus until they give us ANOTHER team. 

Who do you guys want?  The Lakers? The Heat? The Bucks?

 

#MemphisHeat

#MemphoBucks

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4 hours ago, bhoyal said:

Nesmith has decided to hire an agent.  He's all in.  No more college ball.

https://247sports.com/college/basketball/recruiting/Article/Aaron-Nesmith-NBA-Draft-Vanderbilt-145380550/

He’s good.  I need to do more research on him.  He might be a guy worth trading up for.  I’ve got him at 16 on my big board.  
 

Onyeka Okongwu declared for the draft too although maybe the draft gets pushed back too.  
 

This Lockdown is gonna make a tough draft even tougher.

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23 hours ago, bhoyal said:

His highlights looked awesome!  Nessmith has a fantastic shot.  He also had a couple of good finishes with some dunks in there.  
 

Looks like an ideal fit for a team who needs a 2 guard/shooting.  
 

Seems to have less hype but better shooting ability than Anthony Edwards.  
 

I doubt we could move up to get either (unless we trade Clarke too) with Isaiah Joe maybe also being tough to get.  I am gonna look into Mason Jones more.  Binge scorer who can rack up the 3 point shots.  He’s probably a guy we could draft in that early 40’s range.  Markus Howard is tiny but he might be worth looking into.  Especially if we could go with an ultra-small backcourt with him and Ja.  

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Draft lotto on August 25th.

NBA Draft on October 15th.

Looks like starting in late July we are gonna get 1 straight year of basketball (assuming a bit of college basketball later in the year too).

https://www.reddit.com/r/CollegeBasketball/comments/gwmatm/woj_nba_has_set_an_august_25_draft_lottery_and/

... should be an interesting draft.  Looks like if we don't get in then we still have a shot at a top 4 pick.  Or, if we lose in an 8/9 play-in round.

Not sure how the combine is gonna work out (I think it is gonna be virtual everything).

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Memphis is going to lose the pick no matter this year correct?

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1 hour ago, grizzgolf said:

Memphis is going to lose the pick no matter this year correct?

1 hour ago, grizzgolf said:

Memphis is going to lose the pick no matter this year correct?

If it’s in the top 7 we get it 

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15 hours ago, dy_dy_dynomite said:

Just wanna get the prospect with the most potential at 40

There should be some decent players at 40 -- maybe even a potential "upside sleeper pick" or two.

Confusing draft.  Could be chaos.  Although that should favor teams who draft well.

I think that Wiseman/Deni/Ball is my top 3 (in that order basically) but after that I have a hard time sifting the next 20 or 25 players.  

If we don't get into the top 8 then we have about a 2.4% chance (or if we drop a few more games then maybe a 5% or 6% chance) at getting a top 4 pick (otherwise it conveys to Boston).

Odds are, we know where we are picking: 40 or so.  Maybe it depends on the Suns record after this 8 game "runway" to the Brave New Playoffs.

Summer Madness in Orlando SHOULD tell us what we need to add to augment our roster.  I would think that going after 3 POINT SHOOTING but it might come down to who is left on the draft board.

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8 hours ago, ALT GRIND said:

There should be some decent players at 40 -- maybe even a potential "upside sleeper pick" or two.

Confusing draft.  Could be chaos.  Although that should favor teams who draft well.

I think that Wiseman/Deni/Ball is my top 3 (in that order basically) but after that I have a hard time sifting the next 20 or 25 players.  

If we don't get into the top 8 then we have about a 2.4% chance (or if we drop a few more games then maybe a 5% or 6% chance) at getting a top 4 pick (otherwise it conveys to Boston).

Odds are, we know where we are picking: 40 or so.  Maybe it depends on the Suns record after this 8 game "runway" to the Brave New Playoffs.

Summer Madness in Orlando SHOULD tell us what we need to add to augment our roster.  I would think that going after 3 POINT SHOOTING but it might come down to who is left on the draft board.

What are your thoughts on EJ Montgomery/ Trendon Watford/ Jaden McDaniels 

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10 minutes ago, dy_dy_dynomite said:

What are your thoughts on EJ Montgomery/ Trendon Watford/ Jaden McDaniels 

EJ? Don’t have a great read on him yet.  Seems like a versatile forward.  Guess every team needs guys like that off the bench.  If we move Slo Mo then he becomes more of an option (or a guy with that archetype).  The radio guys this morning reminded everyone that we have Jontay Porter on the roster.  He’s basically a versatile big forward.

Trendon Watford sounds pretty good.  Scorer type.  Not a freak athlete I don’t think.  Probably a guy in that mid/late second round range although I don’t see him on tons of boards.   He might be a guy to trade down for if he shoots well in workouts or whatever they end up doing (virtual workouts?).

Watford has pedigree but not a ton of buzz.

Jaden McDaniels: he’s all over the place on boards. Man, looks like a guy who can either make or break your mock draft.  Not super long but he has “upside”.  Didn’t put it together but neither did Adam Reddish in college and he still has potential and played better towards the “end” of the pre-new normal season.  

Jaden actually reminds me of Rudy Gay.  Long, athletic, good mix of scoring and defensive potential.  Wish he was longer and more explosive and assertive.  Could be a better shooter, but if he had all that he would be a top 3-5 pick.  Downside: motor issues (like Rudy?).  

Man, if he panned out he could give us a killer front line rotation of Jaden/Clarke/Jaren or Jaden/Jaren/Jonas for a really big front line.  Good option at 40 even if he doesn’t reach his “ceiling”.  That archetype is just valuable.  Maybe he even has more Moneyball value than a upside/wild card guy like Aleksej Pokusevksi.  Quicker better lateral movement.   

Man, I’ve been having a hard time picking a guy for the 10th spot on my big boards.  Might just Jaden at 10. Rudy Gay went 10 (I think).  Not a ton of high ceiling guys that also have decent floors.  Yeah he is probably worth a strong look.  One of the few “move up” guys if he projects near the lower end of his draft night projection.  

Without having much of a firm grasp on these guys, Jaden has “upside”.  If Rudy Gay is his baseline-ish then you get a good sleeper pick outside the lotto.  Watford seems more like a “scorer” than an EJ Montgomery who maybe helps you without scoring (low usage).

Other than Jaden, I like Tyler Bey, Cassius Stanley as wings/forwards — I have them super high.  Without any higher end options I like Markus Howard in that draft range. Absolute stud shooter/scorer with awesome range.  Shades of Chris Jackson aka Mahmoud Abdul-Raouf.  

Bigs who should be there at 40: Nick Richards is your generic (with upside) rim runner who can also block shots.  Borisa Simanic is an older import who isn’t that long but can shoot 3’s, dunk and blocks shots.  Looks like he can move pretty well.  Someone on Real GM Forums thinks he has attitude problems but maybe he can be an “enforcer” for us (if he puts on more muscle).  He’s also skinny and old but I like his highlights.    

Yeah if Jaden is there you take a strong look maybe even move up a bit to get him.  Watford and EJ look like trade down candidates.  I can see EJ being a “system guy” with Watford maybe being a decent bench scorer.  

Other mid-second options: Isiah Joe, Mason Jones. Sleeper Yves Pons if you buy his multi-positional defensive potential, 3 point shot and functional athleticism.  Karim Mane is an interesting player (nice highlights).  3 solid power forward prospects who could either go higher or lower include Xavier Tillman, Paul Reed and Isaiah Stewart. Maybe only one of those guys is there (if at all).  If the rest of the season/playoffs show that we need extra rebounding, garbage scoring and overall depth inside then these power forwards should be worth a look.  

My gut says either trade up for the guy we want OR trade down and draft a perimeter guy and a big/front court player.  

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1 hour ago, dy_dy_dynomite said:

What are your thoughts on EJ Montgomery/ Trendon Watford/ Jaden McDaniels 

EJ too soft no skill

Trendon mildly skilled, average athlete nothing special 

Jaden can’t create a shot not skilled doesn’t really have a position. 
 

all the above are going to struggle on defense 

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On 6/9/2020 at 9:52 PM, dy_dy_dynomite said:

 

Which I assume the odds of that happening are pretty slim. 

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13 hours ago, QMemphis said:

EJ too soft no skill

Trendon mildly skilled, average athlete nothing special 

Jaden can’t create a shot not skilled doesn’t really have a position. 
 

all the above are going to struggle on defense 

I see "flashes of Rudy Gay" in Jaden McDaniel's game.  What about you?  Even if Slightly Poor Man's Rudy Gay is his "upside" I think you still look at that player at 40 if you think he can provide quality minutes off the bench fairly soon.  

If we take a forward or a big man then I think we look at players with a solid combination of shooting, defense, and rebounding.  Or, at least I would.  Then give the benefit of the doubt/tie breaker to players with some length and athleticism.

What position does Jaden play?  Depends on what he can defend.  Supposedly he is ok in that department so a front line of Jaden/Clarke/Jaren should work.  And, all those 3 guys show shades of "big man skills" and also combo forward/big wing skills.  

... even if Trendon Watford is limited if he can shoot and score some then he should be a player we look at at 40.  

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Either go for the boom or bust pick like a Jay Scrubb or just take the best shooter available and if he makes the team, great. If not, no big deal he was the 40th pick and we will still have a nice young roster to work with especially if we are able to resign Melton (Josh Jackson would be nice too).

I don't think there is much pressure to get this pick right, they can afford to take a chance on a boom or bust guy or take a guy based on a skillset in need.

Now if there is a guy they feel strongly about and can move up without giving too much up then make the move but I'm not sure that guy exists in this draft. If all it takes one of the future 2nd rounders we have accumulated and its a guy they really want then that's a no-brainer.

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2 minutes ago, KyleB said:

Take the best shooter available and if he makes the team, great. If not, no big deal we will still have a nice young roster to work with especially if we are able to resign Melton (Josh Jackson would be nice too).

I've got Markus Howard 30 or 40 spots too high on my board.  Yeah, he is small, not long, and not an uber athlete but he is a really good shooter and an explosive scorer.  Maybe even a College Basketball Mount Rushmore type shooter.  

He and Ja would have defensive limitations (to say the least), but should be thermo-nuclear on offense.

Ideally, we can trade down to get Markus Howard AND another player (BPA).

Tyler Bey is someone I am really warming up to (some poster here liked him a lot for awhile), and he is moving up on the draftnik boards.  

Cassius Stanley is still under-rated in my opinion.  

If we want a Razorback or two then Mason Jones and Isaiah Joe are at least worth a look.  

Upside with the Arkansas guys and Markus Howard is that I can see them getting off five 3 pointers a night off the bench -- they are also guys who could potentially be 10X Shooters (my name for guys who can ostensibly take 10 3 pointers a night).  10X Shooters should be super valuable now, and going into the future.

On my internal big board from a couple days ago I have Cassius Stanley at 6, Tyler Bey at 7, Markus Howard at 14, Jaden McDaniels at 20, Isaiah Joe at 30 and Mason Jones at 31.  To me, those are "best of breed" high value role players.  ... I also have Yves Pons higher on my board than Isaac Okoro in that Grit/Grind athletic/versatile defender/finisher archetype.

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I wish Chris Duarte were coming out this year. We've had good luck with Canadian Ducks taken in the second round. 

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Wiseman and Edwards are great prospects. I like Deni Advija a lot too, and I do think those guys can be stars, but they are out of our range so I dont see the point on focus on those guys.

I like Aaron Nesmith, but he is getting some lottery talk, he is like a Klay Thompson kind prospect, and he would be perfect to have next to Ja as a backcourt pair. But he is probably out of our range too.

Other than that, I really like the Duke guys, and we are already all in Duke bench mode. So Vernon Carey and Cassius Stanley would be great bench players. Stanley is a project, but a project that could turn into a sixthman or a VC type of player/star, and that would be another great complimentation Ja's game. Can you imagine a more exciting backcourt to watch than those guys in transition?

Vernon is the perfect future replacement for JV, and with Jaren and Clarke he would fit well as the 3rd/4th bigman. He is like Wendell Carter, but is not as hyped as Carter was in 2018 draft.

Ppl is really high on Okoro, both of Beys kids and Jaden as fowards. And althought I like all of them, special as great defenders, not Jaden (Saddiq and Okoro are probably the best 3&D sf prospects). I like Patrick Williams as our pick. 

He screams steal of the draft for me. Williams is really young, and kind under the radar, if you think as high as I do of him (I dont understand why he isnt on late lottery conversation). The guy can shoot, defend and has some pick and roll scoring potential, if he continues to devolop his ball halldling,  his jumpers and defense; he has everything to be a elite wing player, a 3&D foward.

The guy sees/mold himself as a player like Paul George and Kawhi. Althought he is kind of a tweener forward and really raw, but I can see him devoloping in that kind of player, so we should not be scaried to take a risk and get a late 1st to replace SlowMo with P Williams. 

 

PS.: The problemn with all the draft conversation is that we probably wont have the pick necessary be agressive in it.

 

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I have no idea on who the Grizzlies get in our range (probably 40th pick).  But it's nice to have some confidence in our front-office with the results of the last few drafts.  Very nice after years of pretty bad overall results.  

If I had to guess, I would say Tre Jones if he's available.  Or, since we have a young team already ... I could easily see us trying to trade out of this draft for a couple of future second round picks.  We already have some good young talent that haven't had much time in our rotation ... I'm not ready to give up on Yuta or Konchar (and don't forget Porter).

Of the high picks, I still wouldn't pass on Wiseman regardless of team.  He's just too skilled of a big man to fail and looks built for basketball.  He might get pushed around a bit for a year or two, but even then he will still be effective.

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On 6/14/2020 at 6:49 AM, Ja_Rules said:

Wiseman and Edwards are great prospects. I like Deni Advija a lot too, and I do think those guys can be stars, but they are out of our range so I dont see the point on focus on those guys.

I like Aaron Nesmith, but he is getting some lottery talk, he is like a Klay Thompson kind prospect, and he would be perfect to have next to Ja as a backcourt pair. But he is probably out of our range too.

Other than that, I really like the Duke guys, and we are already all in Duke bench mode. So Vernon Carey and Cassius Stanley would be great bench players. Stanley is a project, but a project that could turn into a sixthman or a VC type of player/star, and that would be another great complimentation Ja's game. Can you imagine a more exciting backcourt to watch than those guys in transition?

Vernon is the perfect future replacement for JV, and with Jaren and Clarke he would fit well as the 3rd/4th bigman. He is like Wendell Carter, but is not as hyped as Carter was in 2018 draft.

Ppl is really high on Okoro, both of Beys kids and Jaden as fowards. And althought I like all of them, special as great defenders, not Jaden (Saddiq and Okoro are probably the best 3&D sf prospects). I like Patrick Williams as our pick. 

He screams steal of the draft for me. Williams is really young, and kind under the radar, if you think as high as I do of him (I dont understand why he isnt on late lottery conversation). The guy can shoot, defend and has some pick and roll scoring potential, if he continues to devolop his ball halldling,  his jumpers and defense; he has everything to be a elite wing player, a 3&D foward.

The guy sees/mold himself as a player like Paul George and Kawhi. Althought he is kind of a tweener forward and really raw, but I can see him devoloping in that kind of player, so we should not be scaried to take a risk and get a late 1st to replace SlowMo with P Williams. 

 

PS.: The problemn with all the draft conversation is that we probably wont have the pick necessary be agressive in it.

 

Lots of people like Patrick Williams. He is moving up big time.  I don’t have a great feel for his game or upside but he “looks” like a Paul George/athletic lanky wing prototype.  Kawhi would be the defensive version of that prototype with Tatum being the offensive-minded version of that prototype.  

I also like Cassius Stanley although CBS sports has him around 21 in their latest mock draft so I guess he is moving up too.  I guess others are seeing his athleticism, defense and corner 3 point shooting.  That mock said he was a top notch 3% shooter in some areas (guessing corners).  He is also a solid rebounder for his position.  His baseline is probably a more athletic Dahntay Jones with better projected 3 point shooting.  Upside: TA and Brandon Clarke blend.

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18 hours ago, dy_dy_dynomite said:

If we bring back Jackson and Melton the wing is set. Best bet is to get a point guard or Center to compete for the future back up center spot

As far as point guards go I think a lot of the bigger names are overrated (although I have LaMelo as a top 3 or 4 pick), but I like Malachi Flynn as a good all-around point guard.  His 3 point shot should project on.  Markus Howard is more one dimensional/limited but he can flat out shoot the rock baby (paging Dickie V).  Here’s a guy who can score from anywhere and in bunches a la Mamoud Abdul-Raouf aka the former Chris Jackson.  I have both Flynn and Howard absurdly high on my draft boards.  Markus Howard projects as a solid to great instant offense 6th man as well as a secondary ball handler.  If we can scheme a defense around a Ja/Markus backcourt rotation then that might be Splash Bros. level scoring and electricity.  Flynn could end up being a poor man’s Steph Curry with one of the better all-around games (for a point guard) in the draft.

Tre Jones, Cassius Stanley and other guys like that might be more “trade down” candidates.  At 40 you can probably take a look at Theo Maledon if we think he would fit well with Ja in dual point guard line ups although I might like Howard or Flynn more.  

Nick Richards looks like a decent backup shot blocker/dunker type.  Jay Huff also fits that archetype.  Borisa Simanic is a deep sleeper candidate with solid highlights filled with 3’s, dunks and blocked shots.  Looks like he moves fairly well too.  The upside with those 3 is that maybe you can trade down to get them.  I’m not getting rid of JV any time soon but if we need a fourth big behind Jaren/Jonas/Clarke then Isaiah Stewart and Paul Reed could be worth a look.  If Reed can work on his shot then he should be the better bet unless Isaiah Stewart can be Michael Cage 2.0.  

Yves Pons should be there at 40 or even lower. He has potential as a multi-positional defender and rebounder.  Just dunks and maybe some 3’s on offense but maybe that’s all you need.  If we trade down and get either a point guard or center then Yves Pons might be a good/Moneyball second pick.  

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