Ole Dirty Klondike

What Should We Do if We Luck Into The #1 Pick In 2020?

Should We Tank for Wiseman?  

44 members have voted

  1. 1. If we get the #1 pick in the 2020 draft, what should we do?

    • Draft Wiseman, pair him with JJJ and trade Jonas
      12
    • Draft Wiseman, pair him with Jonas and trade JJJ
      4
    • Draft Anthony Edwards and keep JJJ and Jonas
      16
    • Draft LaMelo Ball and keep JJJ and Jonas
      2
    • Draft someone else, preferably a swingman, and keep JJJ and Jonas
      10


Recommended Posts

5 minutes ago, srmjr23 said:

NCAA is so trash. If this is Wiseman's last college game the dude is gonna drop 40 and 20. 

Garbage. Everybody knows Penny helped them move to Memphis long before he was a Memphis coach.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Dwash said:

Garbage. Everybody knows Penny helped them move to Memphis long before he was a Memphis coach.

That’s where it won’t stick. It was also right when Tubby was hired so it’s nowhere near the same.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, ALT GRIND said:

It’s strange.  This is going to court.  Let’s see what happens.

https://www.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/college/memphis-tigers/basketball/2019/11/08/james-wiseman-ineligible-memphis-tigers-basketball-ncaa/2513758001/

"James Wiseman, the top prospect in Memphis basketball's ballyhooed No. 1 recruiting class, was ruled ineligible by the NCAA earlier this week, his Memphis-based attorney, Leslie Ballin announced Friday evening. 

However, in a saga that played out just before the Tigers' Friday night game against Illinois-Chicago, Ballin said Wiseman was granted an immediate temporary restraining order by a Shelby County Judicial Court judge that put the NCAA's ineligibility decision on hold pending further litigation."

 

He's got a very very good lawyer

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Memphis Maverick said:

That’s where it won’t stick. It was also right when Tubby was hired so it’s nowhere near the same.

It was after Tubby's first year that Wiseman moved. I dont know if this is part of the case but there was some light chatter about him becoming the next coach during that time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm glad they're fighting this cause the NCAA is a sham organization that is picking at nits. They already cleared him and then right before the 1st game of the season they rule that he is "likely ineligible". Why not rule that back in May?This whole thing about Penny being a booster in perpetuity because he gave a donation to the university in 2008 is ridiculous. Well, he should have never been approved to be a coach then right, cause boosters can't recruit players right? Ok, he gave the mother money to move. Wiseman didn't know about it. It's not like Wiseman was out on the streets dealing with some shady drug dealer who wanted him to shave points in games or something. Penny has helped tons of people financially including other people on the team and everyone knows it. 

I get the feeling if the lawyer can make the case that the "booster in perpetuity" rule makes absolutely no sense because Wiseman was about 8 years old when Penny made that donation (to his alma mater which happens all of the time) and that Wiseman had no knowledge of his mother accepting that gift for moving expenses and she is willing to pay it back based on a loan that is backed by Wiseman's future earnings, the NCAA should od the right thing and let the kid play. But this is the NCAA and they like punishing programs, especially smaller less endowed non-P5 programs, just because they can.  UNC should have gotten the death penalty for what they were doing but they didn't. Darrell Arthur was ineligible to play but they never went back and ruled Kansas ineligible. 

I hate to bring race into this but there is something not right about the NCAA and how it monitors,controls, etc it's "student athletes" especially in the revenue generating sports. There's a guy right now at Ohio State who has to sit out cause his mother accepting a loan from a family friend which they have paid back. I remember them going after Eric Bledsoe because his mother accepting some money from someone to pay her rent. So the NCAA would rather someone be homeless than have a family friend give $500 to help a mother pay rent? The NCAA's zero-tolerance, cookie cutter rules are archaic, outdated and in many cases just plain not realistic in today's times and it repeatedly punishes people from impoverished backgrounds who are trying to bring themselves out of that poverty and live the American dream. They should be ashamed of themselves. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, ALT GRIND said:

It’s strange.  This is going to court.  Let’s see what happens.

then he plays oversea , entered the N.B.A draft next year , the only one who gets HURT is the Memphis tiger basketball , this will be Coach CAL part 2 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Ole Dirty Klondike said:

I'm glad they're fighting this cause the NCAA is a sham organization that is picking at nits. They already cleared him and then right before the 1st game of the season they rule that he is "likely ineligible". Why not rule that back in May?This whole thing about Penny being a booster in perpetuity because he gave a donation to the university in 2008 is ridiculous. Well, he should have never been approved to be a coach then right, cause boosters can't recruit players right? Ok, he gave the mother money to move. Wiseman didn't know about it. It's not like Wiseman was out on the streets dealing with some shady drug dealer who wanted him to shave points in games or something. Penny has helped tons of people financially including other people on the team and everyone knows it. 

I get the feeling if the lawyer can make the case that the "booster in perpetuity" rule makes absolutely no sense because Wiseman was about 8 years old when Penny made that donation (to his alma mater which happens all of the time) and that Wiseman had no knowledge of his mother accepting that gift for moving expenses and she is willing to pay it back based on a loan that is backed by Wiseman's future earnings, the NCAA should od the right thing and let the kid play. But this is the NCAA and they like punishing programs, especially smaller less endowed non-P5 programs, just because they can.  UNC should have gotten the death penalty for what they were doing but they didn't. Darrell Arthur was ineligible to play but they never went back and ruled Kansas ineligible. 

I hate to bring race into this but there is something not right about the NCAA and how it monitors,controls, etc it's "student athletes" especially in the revenue generating sports. There's a guy right now at Ohio State who has to sit out cause his mother accepting a loan from a family friend which they have paid back. I remember them going after Eric Bledsoe because his mother accepting some money from someone to pay her rent. So the NCAA would rather someone be homeless than have a family friend give $500 to help a mother pay rent? The NCAA's zero-tolerance, cookie cutter rules are archaic, outdated and in many cases just plain not realistic in today's times and it repeatedly punishes people from impoverished backgrounds who are trying to bring themselves out of that poverty and live the American dream. They should be ashamed of themselves. 

 

Agree with that first paragraph, I don't understand how they can clear him in May IF ALL THE INFORMATION WAS SHARED AT THAT TIME, and then change their ruling 5 months later.

However, I'm also concerned now that the NCAA claims that they played a likely ineligible player and now they are on a post season ban.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Grizzled Vet said:

 

Agree with that first paragraph, I don't understand how they can clear him in May IF ALL THE INFORMATION WAS SHARED AT THAT TIME, and then change their ruling 5 months later.

However, I'm also concerned now that the NCAA claims that they played a likely ineligible player and now they are on a post season ban.

I see forfeiture of games. I dont see a postseason ban beyond this season. You usually have to cheat or commit seriously illegal actions to get long term bans. This is more of a technicality, with no intentional harm done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

My new prospect love. Not known as a shooter but can develop one. As good as Edwards is Im a little worried that he is just physical mature with an advanced jumper at an earlier age than most. And that his size hampers his potential.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, Dwash said:

My new prospect love. Not known as a shooter but can develop one. As good as Edwards is Im a little worried that he is just physical mature with an advanced jumper at an earlier age than most. And that his size hampers his potential.

Yeah I kinda get Dajuan Wagner vibes from Anthony Edwards. Not really explosive or really athletic and yeah he kinda looks “old” for his age.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, ALT GRIND said:

Yeah I kinda get Dajuan Wagner vibes from Anthony Edwards. Not really explosive or really athletic and yeah he kinda looks “old” for his age.

Oh he is athletic lol. But not super shifty. Kind of a straight line type. Great player though dont get me wrong.  Just not 100% on him being the best choice. McDaniels, Avdija look very versatile.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tigers vs. Oregon tonight.

Let's see what James Wiseman does.  Will he continue to look like a player with number 1 potential?

Also interested to see Precious Achiuwa.  Lots of upside/potential there as a high motor all-around guy who can finish, rebound, and maybe guard multiple positions.  Can he knock down enough shots?  If he can play the 3 on the next level then he could end up being a top 5 pick.

DJ Jeffries, Damion Baugh, Lester Quinones, and Boogie Ellis might not all be one-and-dones but they are worth looking at as potential (value?) picks in the next few drafts.  Then again, the ENTIRE MEMPHIS TIGERS BASKETBALL PROGRAM could be... ONE AND DONE.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So a Memphis Tiger legend helps Wiseman move to Memphis then recruits him to his school after hired there and yall homers don't see anything wrong with that? Penny can clearly be viewed as a Memphis booster helping steer Wiseman to his alma mater no matter if he became the coach or not. Shady af.

Now flame away.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, CoolHandGriz said:

So a Memphis Tiger legend helps Wiseman move to Memphis then recruits him to his school after hired there and yall homers don't see anything wrong with that? Penny was clearly a Memphis booster helping steer Wiseman to his alma mater no matter if he became the coach or not. Shady af.

Now flame away.

When he paid his family in 2017 coaching Memphis wasnt even on his radar. He paid him to come to East. Penny and Cal had a cordial relationship and he was all behind Wiseman going to Kentucky.  NOBODY who cared about their player at all was steering them to go play for Tubby Smith lol. That in itself sounds ridiculous. Tubby was completing year one of a 5 year deal that made him a top 10-15 paid coach in America. So firing him and replacing him with Penny was nowhere on the horizon.  Most thought ir was crazy.

Penny was also going to get Dennis Smith to East before he got hurt and tried to get Jayson Tatum.  He wasnt doing this stuff for U of M. He was doing it for his high school agenda. Thats a known fact.

Also, an athletic booster has to donate to an athletic program. Pennu donated to the sports hall of fame.

Penny may have violated some rules but shady....nah. Not even close.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, CoolHandGriz said:

So a Memphis Tiger legend helps Wiseman move to Memphis then recruits him to his school after hired there and yall homers don't see anything wrong with that? Penny can clearly be viewed as a Memphis booster helping steer Wiseman to his alma mater no matter if he became the coach or not. Shady af.

Now flame away.

The Penny-Haul truck showed up before the Calipari Movers truck showed up.

#discuss

#SamGilbertIsRollingOverInHisGrave

#ClevelandStateIsGoingToPAYForThis

#BlueChipsHard2 #BlueChipsHARDER

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Dwash said:

When he paid his family in 2017 coaching Memphis wasnt even on his radar. He paid him to come to East. Penny and Cal had a cordial relationship and he was all behind Wiseman going to Kentucky.  NOBODY who cared about their player at all was steering them to go play for Tubby Smith lol. That in itself sounds ridiculous. Tubby was completing year one of a 5 year deal that made him a top 10-15 paid coach in America. So firing him and replacing him with Penny was nowhere on the horizon.  Most thought ir was crazy.

Also, an athletic booster has to donate to an athletic program. Pennu donated to the sports hall of fame.

Penny may have violated some rules but shady....nah. Not even close.

Hey I'm all for Wiseman playing this year even though i'm not a Tiger fan. And I get the fact that Penny wasn't financially helping him AT THAT TIME in order to steer him to Memphis, I'm just telling you how it looks from outside Shelby County. Folks here in Nashville are obviously just butt hurt about Wiseman but I do agree the optics are turrible.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, CoolHandGriz said:

Hey I'm all for Wiseman playing this year even though i'm not a Tiger fan. And I get the fact that Penny wasn't financially helping him AT THAT TIME in order to steer him to Memphis, I'm just telling you how it looks from outside Shelby County. Folks here in Nashville are obviously just butt hurt about Wiseman but I do agree the optics are turrible.

It only looks that way cause people have been trying to "imply" that Penny is cheating because he is filty rich and all these kids want to go to Memphis. Im telling you thats nonsense from people that know about Penny's work, not some Memphis homers. Dude has been working his butt off on the AAU/high school scene and these kids love him because he is an extremely relatable older guy on one hand but when it comes to the business side he is still professional enough to be a college coach. Its a unique mix that has never been seen before instead of the stuffy old white man coaching and people want to find a hole in it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, CoolHandGriz said:

Hey I'm all for Wiseman playing this year even though i'm not a Tiger fan. And I get the fact that Penny wasn't financially helping him AT THAT TIME in order to steer him to Memphis, I'm just telling you how it looks from outside Shelby County. Folks here in Nashville are obviously just butt hurt about Wiseman but I do agree the optics are turrible.

It looks like we are gonna play him no matter what -- then deal with the consequences later.  Might be a bad look for us later but I don't see us getting the Full SMU Treatment (Double Plus Death Penalty with two CANCELED football seasons).  I think they vacate THIS season but that's about it.  Maybe a post-season ban next season.  BUT, probably worth it IF we run the table during the regular season/conference tournament.  THEN we are THE TEAM, we can throw a parade and also put an asterisk next to the name of the "OFFISHUL" national champion.

We are gonna stink next season?  Well, we stunk under Pastner/Tubby so we might as well have gone for it.

Guess it is gonna be an ESPN 30 For 30 TRILOGY.

Then once this entire Memphis Tigers recruiting class (plus last years') gets drafted, graduates, or fades off into the sunset then we can do a PROPER full rebuild.

The one-and-done rule might be DONE by then, too.  At that point, you are looking at recruiting classes which lean heavily on local and regional players.  Then "sustainable success" for us would be a Sweet 16 every 3 years and an Elite 8 every five to ten years.

We probably won't be able to get another five star Fab Five-type recruiting class again, but maybe no one else will either.  I think the top blue chip studs go straight to the pros.  The others try to be "the man" at a solid program where they can build their "brand".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, CoolHandGriz said:

So a Memphis Tiger legend helps Wiseman move to Memphis then recruits him to his school after hired there and yall homers don't see anything wrong with that? Penny can clearly be viewed as a Memphis booster helping steer Wiseman to his alma mater no matter if he became the coach or not. Shady af.

Now flame away.

Funny how the people on both sides are framing this.

On the dark side, Wiseman's family was coerced to move here by Penny's money strictly to play basketball for a school he reasonably assumed he would be coaching soon. The fact that the money lent was a paltry amount and the family wanted to move to Memphis already is immaterial. If there is smoke there is a fire somewhere and most likely the fire has to do with basketball. 

On the light side, Penny helped a family move to Memphis and he knew it would help his basketball team at the time but that has nothing to do with the University of Memphis. East High School is not related to the University. The NCAA is punishing a young man who signed with Memphis after the NCAA cleared him to play. He can't go anywhere else now and suddenly the NCAA is taking back the guarantee and taking away his ability to make money. Penny hadn't given money to the University of Memphis since 2008. He gave moving expenses to the family and Wiseman didn't even know about it. There is no quid pro quo here. 

In my opinion what Penny did was both kind-hearted and self-serving. He surely suspected that Wiseman would help him win a lot of games which would make him attractive to the U of M as a head coach. He had to suspect that he could attract Wiseman and others to the program if he was already coaching them.

Was it illegal? I don't know enough to say one way or the other. What it shady. Absolutely but it also could be seen as a wealthy man taking care of people who would benefit from his assistance. I believe Penny helped other families as well who didn't have basketball players as sons. $12,000 is nothing if the implication is that Wiseman's family was being bought. 

For me, the bottom line issue is that the NCAA cleared Wiseman to play at the school after the school reported the violation. For the NCAA to now rescind that permission after the start of the season when Wiseman can't transfer to any other school is a punishment far harsher than the crime. Fine the coach or the school but not the student who was ignorant and innocent of the crime.  Perhaps the NCAA was premature in issuing the clearance but it is too late now to rescind it. The penalty doesn't fit the crime. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, chipc3 said:

Funny how the people on both sides are framing this.

On the dark side, Wiseman's family was coerced to move here by Penny's money strictly to play basketball for a school he reasonably assumed he would be coaching soon. The fact that the money lent was a paltry amount and the family wanted to move to Memphis already is immaterial. If there is smoke there is a fire somewhere and most likely the fire has to do with basketball. 

On the light side, Penny helped a family move to Memphis and he knew it would help his basketball team at the time but that has nothing to do with the University of Memphis. East High School is not related to the University. The NCAA is punishing a young man who signed with Memphis after the NCAA cleared him to play. He can't go anywhere else now and suddenly the NCAA is taking back the guarantee and taking away his ability to make money. Penny hadn't given money to the University of Memphis since 2008. He gave moving expenses to the family and Wiseman didn't even know about it. There is no quid pro quo here. 

In my opinion what Penny did was both kind-hearted and self-serving. He surely suspected that Wiseman would help him win a lot of games which would make him attractive to the U of M as a head coach. He had to suspect that he could attract Wiseman and others to the program if he was already coaching them.

Was it illegal? I don't know enough to say one way or the other. What it shady. Absolutely but it also could be seen as a wealthy man taking care of people who would benefit from his assistance. I believe Penny helped other families as well who didn't have basketball players as sons. $12,000 is nothing if the implication is that Wiseman's family was being bought. 

For me, the bottom line issue is that the NCAA cleared Wiseman to play at the school after the school reported the violation. For the NCAA to now rescind that permission after the start of the season when Wiseman can't transfer to any other school is a punishment far harsher than the crime. Fine the coach or the school but not the student who was ignorant and innocent of the crime.  Perhaps the NCAA was premature in issuing the clearance but it is too late now to rescind it. The penalty doesn't fit the crime. 

Agree on all counts.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now