Lord Gordon

Time to trade Marc

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It’s time for the Grizz and Marc to part ways. It’s obvious after the NO game he does not want to be here. That’s ok. Marc has shown loyalty to Memphis and Memphis in return —the front office by paying him and the fans sticking by him despite his often marshmallow play.

We need to trade him now before he opts out at the end of the year and we get nothing for him. But knowing Wallace, that is what he will do, let Marc walk for nothing.

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It was time years ago. 

Hes not a good enough player to be holding this team hostage like he’s doing 

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I'm so 50/50 on this.  I want to rebuild but I also want to make the playoffs this season. 

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13 minutes ago, grizzgolf said:

I'm so 50/50 on this.  I want to rebuild but I also want to make the playoffs this season. 

Why?

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2 minutes ago, grizzgolf said:

I'm so 50/50 on this.  I want to rebuild but I also want to make the playoffs this season. 

I tought like you 2 weeks ago but right now we must be realistic. PO are more than a dream.

West is a hell and we're 14th, six straight L, our offense is pathetic, it's a miracle when we can reach 100pts. I am usually an optimist but right now we're embarrassing, we're in free fall.

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53 minutes ago, grizzgolf said:

I'm so 50/50 on this.  I want to rebuild but I also want to make the playoffs this season. 

We aren’t going to make the playoffs this year..  we just aren’t good enough.. ever since we went “young”. Not enough veteran players on this team tbh..

we are a young, unatheltic, slow paced team, with a horrible first year coach.. that’s a recipe for disaster 

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42 minutes ago, Lord Gordon said:

It’s time for the Grizz and Marc to part ways. It’s obvious after the NO game he does not want to be here. That’s ok. Marc has shown loyalty to Memphis and Memphis in return —the front office by paying him and the fans sticking by him despite his often marshmallow play.

We need to trade him now before he opts out at the end of the year and we get nothing for him. But knowing Wallace, that is what he will do, let Marc walk for nothing.

While I am not opposed to trading him and sometimes advocate trading him, I'm actually fine with letting him opt out. I understand the sentiment that we will let him walk for nothing but I disagree. We are getting a ton of cap space in return. As long as Mike, Marc and Chandler's contracts are on the books, this franchise will be hamstrung. They will account for almost $85 million in salary next year, just those 3 guys.

I don't think Marc will net us much in return and quite honestly, I would much rather let him walk than take back 2-3 average players on long term contracts. That's not helping us financially nor on the floor. That's kind of similar to what we just did with Selden/Brooks for Holiday. Holiday made more than the two of those guys combined so we increased our salary to get a guy who so far doesn't appear to be any better than either of those two guys but people were happy because we made a trade. We made a trade just to make a trade. I may be cynical but I don't think we're going to get anywhere near what most people on this board expect us to get for Marc. I would hate to trade Marc to get 1 solid starter on a longer term deal, a bunch of filler on longer term deals and maybe some second round picks. I'd be surprised if anyone gave us a 1st round pick for Marc in addition to a really good player. I don't see it happening. He's not the type of C that teams are looking for these days plus he's about to be 34 y/o and is known as mopey and moody. 

This franchise needs to hit the reset button and that starts with getting more financial freedom and flexibility this summer. If that means letting Marc walk for nothing this summer, so be it. We shouldn't trade him just to trade him and end up in the same financial situation with salaries committed for a longer term. We should also waive Parsons if we can't sign him by the draft. 

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12 minutes ago, gfaulk09 said:

We aren’t going to make the playoffs this year..  we just aren’t good enough.. ever since we went “young”. Not enough veteran players on this team tbh..

we are a young, unatheltic, slow paced team, with a horrible first year coach.. that’s a recipe for disaster 

We have a lot of veteran players. We just aren't good enough to win- Conley, Temple, Anderson, Gasol, Mack, Casspi, Green, Holiday, and Noah are all NBA veterans. They get most of the playing time. Jaren and Brooks are the only young guys getting any PT and Brooks was hurt for awhile, so really only Jaren. Carter looks like he's about to get more minutes and Rabb is at the end of the bench. We're not a young team at all. We have 9 players over 28 y/o and 6 of those are over 30 (including Parsons). We only have 4 guys  (Jaren, Jevon, Dillon and Rabb) outside of Jaren, how many minutes have the young guys gotten?

We can't blame this on some youth movement. These guys are veterans, they just aren't that good. 

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Any chance that Boston would take Marc in return for getting the Grizzlies' 1st rounder back and finishing off the Jeff Green disaster? The Grizzlies are going to need all of the draft picks that they can get (which is why they really should not have done the Holiday trade).

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5 minutes ago, HPGrizz said:

Any chance that Boston would take Marc in return for getting the Grizzlies' 1st rounder back and finishing off the Jeff Green disaster? The Grizzlies are going to need all of the draft picks that they can get (which is why they really should not have done the Holiday trade).

Nope. Only way to make salaries match is to include Kyrie, Horford, Hayward, or Brown/ Tatum in conjunction with 5 players. So no way they do any of those, much less those and our pick back.

 

If we trade Marc, the goal better be to get established young players and picks, even if it means taking back a bad contract.

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I just don't see a Boston or LAL taking Gasol, even though he'd be a good fit with either. 

He's going to opt into next year, because there is no way he will make up that money if he doesn't. Teams trading for him will have to have that $25M of next years cap to consider, and they are all hoping to use that money to sign a Kyrie Irving or Kawhi or Jimmy Butler, not Marc Gasol. 

Sorry guys, we aren't trading any of our 3 largest contracts. Maybe someone can ask Chris Wallace why he couldn't negotiate a bit better, because if Gasol's option was a team option we'd be able to get some good return on him this year I imagine.

 

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I've always been a Marc fan and thus always against trading him.  Until now.

Time to stick a toe in the water and see what the temperature is on a potential Marc trade.  I would think a first round draft slot plus a veteran wing who can shoot, maybe on an expiring contract.  Is that too optimistic?

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I'm all for trading Marc, but not just to trade him.  See Old Dirty Klondike's post.  

I want to trade him so that Jaren would be forced to take on a heavier load, sink or swim.  Because I believe the kid would man up.

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1 hour ago, Ole Dirty Klondike said:

We have a lot of veteran players. We just aren't good enough to win- Conley, Temple, Anderson, Gasol, Mack, Casspi, Green, Holiday, and Noah are all NBA veterans. They get most of the playing time. Jaren and Brooks are the only young guys getting any PT and Brooks was hurt for awhile, so really only Jaren. Carter looks like he's about to get more minutes and Rabb is at the end of the bench. We're not a young team at all. We have 9 players over 28 y/o and 6 of those are over 30 (including Parsons). We only have 4 guys  (Jaren, Jevon, Dillon and Rabb) outside of Jaren, how many minutes have the young guys gotten?

We can't blame this on some youth movement. These guys are veterans, they just aren't that good. 

Exactly. That was the complaint I had this Summer when they made all of those moves. They claimed that the vet, Hi I.Q. players knew how to play "the right way" and would be defensive minded , scrappy, and hustle. "Grit -n-Grind 2.0" was the mantra. The problem was they were Hi I.Q. veterans, but they were journeymen vets for a reason, THEY WEREN'T VERY GOOD PLAYERS. What happened at the beginning of the year was that Temple and Mack were hot, and the bench was deep, and Gasol hadn 't checked out yet. The turning point was when after about the 20th  game, Conley admitted that they were not going to be able to keep up the D for 82 games , so they were going to have to score more. The problem now is that the team isn't D'ing up anybody because they are run down, tired , OLD. They aren't very good scorers, so they just can't compete talent wise with teams with good NBA rosters, unless they get after teams on the defensive end.

As far as trading Gasol, I think they must. He is not going to opt out because no team is gonna offer him half of what he is guaranteed for next year. They need to trade him soon, because they will keep losing until they either bench or trade him, and benching him hurts his trade value. I would even consider packaging him and Conley together, to sweeten the pot. I also said this Summer it was a mistake to try and build a team around Conley and Gasol, so don't go into the draft thinking that Center or PG was not a need. If they are able to trade Gasol, then look to this summer letting JB go and hire a real coach for the team built around JJJ, Brooks, and Carter.  

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1 hour ago, Ole Dirty Klondike said:

We have a lot of veteran players. We just aren't good enough to win- Conley, Temple, Anderson, Gasol, Mack, Casspi, Green, Holiday, and Noah are all NBA veterans. They get most of the playing time. Jaren and Brooks are the only young guys getting any PT and Brooks was hurt for awhile, so really only Jaren. Carter looks like he's about to get more minutes and Rabb is at the end of the bench. We're not a young team at all. We have 9 players over 28 y/o and 6 of those are over 30 (including Parsons). We only have 4 guys  (Jaren, Jevon, Dillon and Rabb) outside of Jaren, how many minutes have the young guys gotten?

We can't blame this on some youth movement. These guys are veterans, they just aren't that good. 

Yep and of the veteran players only Mike, Casspi, and Kyle give consistent production the rest are flotsam.   

1 hour ago, Ole Dirty Klondike said:

While I am not opposed to trading him and sometimes advocate trading him, I'm actually fine with letting him opt out. I understand the sentiment that we will let him walk for nothing but I disagree. We are getting a ton of cap space in return. As long as Mike, Marc and Chandler's contracts are on the books, this franchise will be hamstrung. They will account for almost $85 million in salary next year, just those 3 guys.

I don't think Marc will net us much in return and quite honestly, I would much rather let him walk than take back 2-3 average players on long term contracts. That's not helping us financially nor on the floor. That's kind of similar to what we just did with Selden/Brooks for Holiday. Holiday made more than the two of those guys combined so we increased our salary to get a guy who so far doesn't appear to be any better than either of those two guys but people were happy because we made a trade. We made a trade just to make a trade. I may be cynical but I don't think we're going to get anywhere near what most people on this board expect us to get for Marc. I would hate to trade Marc to get 1 solid starter on a longer term deal, a bunch of filler on longer term deals and maybe some second round picks. I'd be surprised if anyone gave us a 1st round pick for Marc in addition to a really good player. I don't see it happening. He's not the type of C that teams are looking for these days plus he's about to be 34 y/o and is known as mopey and moody. 

This franchise needs to hit the reset button and that starts with getting more financial freedom and flexibility this summer. If that means letting Marc walk for nothing this summer, so be it. We shouldn't trade him just to trade him and end up in the same financial situation with salaries committed for a longer term. We should also waive Parsons if we can't sign him by the draft. 

 

Problem is we now have TWO albatross contracts as of today that are hurting the team : Parsons and Gasol.    Anybody that thinks teams are lining up to take on his trade kicker and player option is delusional.    Only thing we can get for Gasol is a player on a worse deal.   I can see the logic of your proposal.  I just want dude's negative energy and effort off the team.     But there is no real market for a slow, plodding, unathletic, high usage, past prime diva that is prone to mood swings.  I can see teams being more interested in Conley in the east if they are desp.  

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9 minutes ago, Blackwatch said:

Exactly. That was the complaint I had this Summer when they made all of those moves. They claimed that the vet, Hi I.Q. players knew how to play "the right way" and would be defensive minded , scrappy, and hustle. "Grit -n-Grind 2.0" was the mantra. The problem was they were Hi I.Q. veterans, but they were journeymen vets for a reason, THEY WEREN'T VERY GOOD PLAYERS. What happened at the beginning of the year was that Temple and Mack were hot, and the bench was deep, and Gasol hadn 't checked out yet. The turning point was when after about the 20th  game, Conley admitted that they were not going to be able to keep up the D for 82 games , so they were going to have to score more. The problem now is that the team isn't D'ing up anybody because they are run down, tired , OLD. They aren't very good scorers, so they just can't compete talent wise with teams with good NBA rosters, unless they get after teams on the defensive end.

I really believe the problem with the D isn't age but Gasol.    Peter Edmiston mentioned on his broadcast that according to the coaches the defensive was crafted to maximize Gasol and cover for his lack of mobility.      As the stats have shown recently.  The defense actually improves when he sits.    We have enough athletic and smart defensive guys to maintain a top 8 defense OUTSIDE of Old Worn rundown tired Gasol.    He is the real problem.   Jevon, Jaren, Kyle, Mike, Justin, JaM,  Dillon, Omri and even Noah can keep up on the defensive end.     Problem is this team is completely dependent on two players that cannot handle that type of load.   Mike and Marc always needed two other guys or at minimum a 3rd.   THey were never the types that can be a Stockton -Malone type duo to truly carry a franchise by themselves.   To be fair FO recognized that to an extent with Parsons signing.  But that was obviously super dumb to gamble on him. 

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12 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

Yep and of the veteran players only Mike, Casspi, and Kyle give consistent production the rest are flotsam.   

 

Problem is we now have TWO albatross contracts as of today that are hurting the team : Parsons and Gasol.    Anybody that thinks teams are lining up to take on his trade kicker and player option is delusional.    Only thing we can get for Gasol is a player on a worse deal.   I can see the logic of your proposal.  I just want dude's negative energy and effort off the team.     But there is no real market for a slow, plodding, unathletic, high usage, past prime diva that is prone to mood swings.  I can see teams being more interested in Conley in the east if they are desp.  

Yep. There isn't a market for Gasol that gets us much of anything we want.

Same with Conley. Same with Parsons. Conley has some value as a player but who wants a 33 million PG? We could send him to the Bucks for Bledsoe and Snell I guess. Does that really help us though?

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6 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

I really believe the problem with the D isn't age but Gasol.    Peter Edmiston mentioned on his broadcast that according to the coaches the defensive was crafted to maximize Gasol and cover for his lack of mobility.      As the stats have shown recently.  The defense actually improves when he sits.    We have enough athletic and smart defensive guys to maintain a top 8 defense OUTSIDE of Old Worn rundown tired Gasol.    He is the real problem.   Jevon, Jaren, Kyle, Mike, Justin, JaM,  Dillon, Omri and even Noah can keep up on the defensive end.     Problem is this team is completely dependent on two players that cannot handle that type of load.   Mike and Marc always needed two other guys or at minimum a 3rd.   THey were never the types that can be a Stockton -Malone type duo to truly carry a franchise by themselves.   To be fair FO recognized that to an extent with Parsons signing.  But that was obviously super dumb to gamble on him. 

The fatal flaw was building, crafting, or suiting anything to fit Gasol. He has not done enough in the league to warrant that. You are correct, Conley and Gasol aren't Stockton and Malone. They have not, can not, and will not carry a team. Short of a trade, benching Gasol I think could turn this season around and help them compete for a playoff spot. They do have the players that can D-up teams, but they have to bench Gasol to do it. The Addition of Holiday can help with scoring and D, he just has to get acclimated. As long as Gasol is starting, they will keep losing. 

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Zach always covered Marc’s deficiencies. Fizdale tried to bring out the alpha in Marc. Fizz’s mistake was not recognizing  he was trying to bring out something that did not exist. 

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33 minutes ago, Blackwatch said:

The fatal flaw was building, crafting, or suiting anything to fit Gasol. He has not done enough in the league to warrant that. You are correct, Conley and Gasol aren't Stockton and Malone. They have not, can not, and will not carry a team. Short of a trade, benching Gasol I think could turn this season around and help them compete for a playoff spot. They do have the players that can D-up teams, but they have to bench Gasol to do it. The Addition of Holiday can help with scoring and D, he just has to get acclimated. As long as Gasol is starting, they will keep losing. 

+100

I am on the same page with you here.   Remove Gasol from rotation to heal up and change up starting lineup. 

Mike/Temple/Dillon/Kyle/Jaren   with Jevon/Holiday/Omri/JaM/Rabb off the bench.    If they really want Jaren to be a PF then change it to Mike/Dillon/Kyle/Jaren/Noah.      At the very least they can play offense at a faster pace and improve on defense enough to give up that 8th pick.    As rotation constructed now we are gonna mess around and be 6-7 in lottery. 

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2 hours ago, lsugrizzfan said:

Nope. Only way to make salaries match is to include Kyrie, Horford, Hayward, or Brown/ Tatum in conjunction with 5 players. So no way they do any of those, much less those and our pick back.

 

If we trade Marc, the goal better be to get established young players and picks, even if it means taking back a bad contract.

Don't forget trading Marc allows a 15% trade kicker to be exercised as well. Gasol may want to be traded but no one is taking him off our hands in a trade. 

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3 hours ago, Ole Dirty Klondike said:

While I am not opposed to trading him and sometimes advocate trading him, I'm actually fine with letting him opt out. I understand the sentiment that we will let him walk for nothing but I disagree. We are getting a ton of cap space in return. As long as Mike, Marc and Chandler's contracts are on the books, this franchise will be hamstrung. They will account for almost $85 million in salary next year, just those 3 guys.

I don't think Marc will net us much in return and quite honestly, I would much rather let him walk than take back 2-3 average players on long term contracts. That's not helping us financially nor on the floor. That's kind of similar to what we just did with Selden/Brooks for Holiday. Holiday made more than the two of those guys combined so we increased our salary to get a guy who so far doesn't appear to be any better than either of those two guys but people were happy because we made a trade. We made a trade just to make a trade. I may be cynical but I don't think we're going to get anywhere near what most people on this board expect us to get for Marc. I would hate to trade Marc to get 1 solid starter on a longer term deal, a bunch of filler on longer term deals and maybe some second round picks. I'd be surprised if anyone gave us a 1st round pick for Marc in addition to a really good player. I don't see it happening. He's not the type of C that teams are looking for these days plus he's about to be 34 y/o and is known as mopey and moody. 

This franchise needs to hit the reset button and that starts with getting more financial freedom and flexibility this summer. If that means letting Marc walk for nothing this summer, so be it. We shouldn't trade him just to trade him and end up in the same financial situation with salaries committed for a longer term. We should also waive Parsons if we can't sign him by the draft. 

What is this team going to do with cap space?? Sign another Parson's this teams only hope with the current FO is getting lucky either in the draft or via trade......No smart agent will send his client here especially a Max level player......... Marc should have been traded long ago the team should have started over when they decided to let ZBo and TA walk..... however none of that matters if the same people are running the organization.....at this point everyone needs to go except Dillon, Kyle, Jevon, and Jaren.......from the FO down they need to start over it's well past time 

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2 minutes ago, Ndq0327 said:

What is this team going to do with cap space?? Sign another Parson's this teams only hope with the current FO is getting lucky either in the draft or via trade......No smart agent will send his client here especially a Max level player......... Marc should have been traded long ago the team should have started over when they decided to let ZBo and TA walk..... however none of that matters if the same people are running the organization.....at this point everyone needs to go except Dillon, Kyle, Jevon, and Jaren.......from the FO down they need to start over it's well past time 

Probably try to build through the draft and sign solid players for slightly more than the MLE. Build a deep team that's not top heavy and hope to strike gold in draft I'd think. Or stockpile assets using cap space to take bad contracts and picks from other teams.

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In the offseason if he doesn't take a team-friendly deal like Zbo did then trade him.

Either way, the frontcourt needs some revamping. I'd keep Rabb and Noah as 3rd stringers, trade Jam this deadline. And find some upgrades to replace him with;

FAs/trades/draft;
Vonleh, Kanter, Looney, MKG, Lyles, Konate, Robert Franks, Brandon Clark

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we'd be in a lot better shape if our FO stopped looking at 2nds as low value fillers to get scrubs like Holiday and temple  and whatever other guys we've brought in with them  , if holiday and temple are starters your team isn't going to be very good so once again our dumb FO spent 2nds on a bunch of nothing when we should have been hoarding every asset we could  maybe then we could send out a 1st/2nds with parsons next year and made an actual "playoff push" trade if our FO didnt panic every couple weeks .

 

 we could have had been loaded up with picks right now if our FO had ever shown even a little patience . Clips picks , Cha,HEat picks from the Anderson,lee trades , tyreke trade , trading 2nds for temple and holiday and trading a 2nd for move Troy Daniels  . maybe around 8 2nds coming our way in the next few years . i'll take 8 2nds over any of  the guys we have traded for and its not even close . 

if we want to move marc maybe CHA  but i'd want Monk and maybe Frank and dont really care what awful contracts we take on in any deal as long as we are adding youngsters / picks .

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