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Marc Had 20 Pts Through 3 Quarters Vs The Clippers Yet......


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#1 southbluffsgrizzfan

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 02:10 PM

he finished with 20 points after playing 11 mins in the 4th quarter.

This simply cannot happen. The Clippers had no answer for Marc. Their big men were in foul trouble.

Marc had ONE shot attempt in the whole 4th qtr.

When the Clippers knew that we had no answer for CP3 or Jamal Crawford, they continually went to them in the 4th.

But what do the Grizzlies do even though they know the Clippers have no answer for Marc? They continually have empty possessions and turnovers.

I am afraid some of this is coaching and some of this is Marc not being assertive enough.

This must change. It is obvious we have no one right now who is capable of hitting anything resembling an outside shot in the 4th quarter, so we have to be able to count on Marc.

Marc has got be stop deferring and passing in the 4th and take over, draw the fouls. That is pitiful that he could not score even 1 point in the 4th quarter in 11 mins.

#2 Iggy

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 02:25 PM

Step away from the ledge

#3 GrizzTigerFan

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 02:26 PM

This is unfortunately why Marc will not ever be the number 1option on offense. It is not in his DNA to force it or be aggressive on offense.

He rarely ever takes over games on offense or defense his rebounding didn't pickup in the 4th either. His is very lucky Rudy is on the team to take away from the scrutiny he should get for his disappearing acts in the 4th.

Yes I am sure he will get excused because he is a bigman playing a lot of minutes but i think should be held equally responsible.

#4 Dwash

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 02:46 PM

I sometimes wonder if Marc is talented enough or if he thinks he is talented enough to take over games in the 4th and if this is why he doesn't want the ball. As much as he produces, when you watch him, he really only goes to the hole strong in one direction (right) and he isn't a great athlete. Does he think that he has enough tricks in his bag by the time the 4th quarter comes around to finish a game? He only has a couple of moves. You can't catch anybody off guard in the 4th quarter like you can earlier in the game. Most good defenses know what's coming and a locked in. There are no comfy mid range open looks. And teams will do whatever it takes to sit on your best moves.

#5 CoachHesam

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 03:31 PM

View Postsouthbluffsgrizzfan, on 01 November 2012 - 02:10 PM, said:

he finished with 20 points after playing 11 mins in the 4th quarter.

This simply cannot happen. The Clippers had no answer for Marc. Their big men were in foul trouble.

Marc had ONE shot attempt in the whole 4th qtr.

When the Clippers knew that we had no answer for CP3 or Jamal Crawford, they continually went to them in the 4th.

But what do the Grizzlies do even though they know the Clippers have no answer for Marc? They continually have empty possessions and turnovers.

I am afraid some of this is coaching and some of this is Marc not being assertive enough.

This must change. It is obvious we have no one right now who is capable of hitting anything resembling an outside shot in the 4th quarter, so we have to be able to count on Marc.

Marc has got be stop deferring and passing in the 4th and take over, draw the fouls. That is pitiful that he could not score even 1 point in the 4th quarter in 11 mins.

Been saying that for years! that Marc scores but he's not aggressive enough to attack the basket & dunk or rebound. I can't count the number of times I've watched Marc just stand 10 feet from the basket while the ball is falling off the rim and let little guys rebound for him.
HH does the opposite, he endangers his own stats by attacking the basket and extending his arm, so he fouls and gets about 1 rebound every 1-2 minutes while Marc gets the credit for having a nice, clean foul-free time.
If it wasn't for Zach's aggressiveness we would've ended 35-47!
This year and these teams are way too tough and fast for anyone to just stand and pray instead of chasing the ball.
It is definitely better to foul the guy who's about to score than to avoid fouls. The foul makes him shoot freethrows & possibly miss some, also a hit on his arm will mess up his head for a while, technically!
"Nice" is outdated.

#6 southbluffsgrizzfan

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 03:32 PM

View PostIggy, on 01 November 2012 - 02:25 PM, said:

Step away from the ledge
nobody on the ledge. Just a simple observation of what happened last night. Not even close to a ledge. I mean what is the point of a comment like this? I am fully aware that this is game 1 of 82. We lost a road game to a playoff team. It certainly happens.

#7 Iggy

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 04:07 PM

View Postsouthbluffsgrizzfan, on 01 November 2012 - 03:32 PM, said:

nobody on the ledge. Just a simple observation of what happened last night. Not even close to a ledge. I mean what is the point of a comment like this? I am fully aware that this is game 1 of 82. We lost a road game to a playoff team. It certainly happens.

You've posting panicky posts since the game last night.

#8 Teddy.B

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 07:56 PM

View Postsouthbluffsgrizzfan, on 01 November 2012 - 03:32 PM, said:

nobody on the ledge. Just a simple observation of what happened last night. Not even close to a ledge. I mean what is the point of a comment like this? I am fully aware that this is game 1 of 82. We lost a road game to a playoff team. It certainly happens.


Can't make any observations anymore on this board. As long as it's something even deemed to be negative one gets labeled a panic monkey or a hater.

I support the team, but I also state what's on my mind when I see things on the floor, but now all that happens is that it's easy to label someone this or that. When I say something or judge too quickly, I don't mind having a different perspective thrown my way. I can internalize it for myself.

Now though, one comment and you get called a Hater, Weak and Whatnot...........just classless posters. I'd rather not resort to attacking fellow posters. We are after all fans of the same team and want the team to do well why else we wasting time here.

Just because some people are less patient, less optimistic, even to the point of being more critical, it's still in the hope of the betterment of the team (at least in their eyes) no need to be judgmental. The 'ignore' button is there please use it!!

I want to state my observations without getting labeled/name-called whether you agree with me or not. You can however always retort and tell me your views, I welcome that.

#9 new_skool91

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 10:43 PM

Rudy was 3-5 with 6 points in the Fourth, not bad. Yep, Marc had one shot attempt but so did Zach and if you look at the shot chart, it is rather disturbing that we only made 5 shots, all within 12 feet, the ones from 9 and 12 were Rudy. The other three were in the paint, one Rudy, one Zach, one Conley layup. 2-11 on jumpshots, 3-7 in the paint. That's just overall poor offensive execution down the stretch beyond just Marc. I don't know what the problem is, whether it is that we don't play to get good jumpshots and since we don't shoot them well, they pack it in and the spacing is poor and as a result the shots we do get are poor or whatever, but what I do think is that Rudy probably needs to be the man down the stretch. Marc high post to kick to if they double, Zach on the weak side for the offensive boards, Conley and hopefully Ellington if his shot gets going to help space the floor. We can't expect to hold leads down the stretch going 5-18 from the floor in the 4th quarter, and I think we will correct this.

#10 Blue Bear

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 08:04 AM

This is the first game of the Season. Marc played well. I think he may be better this year than last year and he was an allstar. So I am going to delay my thoughts on the guy not being a 4th quarter player.

#11 southbluffsgrizzfan

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 04:55 PM

View PostBlue Bear, on 02 November 2012 - 08:04 AM, said:

This is the first game of the Season. Marc played well. I think he may be better this year than last year and he was an allstar. So I am going to delay my thoughts on the guy not being a 4th quarter player.
I dont necessarily think Marc is "not a 4th quarter guy." I think the whole team should feed the big fella. If he keeps deferring, then Lionel sits all of them down during a time out and says "we are going to go inside to Marc, they have nobody that can stop him. Their big guys are in foul trouble."

Its a team/coaching thing.

The Clippers had no problem going to CP and Crawford in the 4th quarter when they KNEW we could not stop either guy. Im just saying the Grizz need to do the same thing and exploit the matchup that favors them. Its not rocket science. Its not complicated. Just got to do it.

.

#12 GrizzTigerFan

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 06:06 PM

It's the spacing issue Marc and Zbo are ineffective in the paint against smart teams that adjust to us having no shooters in the 4th to keep them honest.

Ellington HAS to be aggressive offensively if not then move him for someone who will. But he can become that player so no need to panic yet.

Inside-out offense only works if you have an OUT as well. That's why tony Allen didn't get a lot of fourth quarter minutes last year. He kills spacing.

Teams like OKC MIA SPURs are able to score so many paint points by driving thru lane be ause they are teams that understand spacing.
Hamed Tony and even Zbo make it hard for us to score because there play style or lack of shooting allows the lanes to be clogged.

Only reason we score any points is because our front court forces turnovers and we run in transition. Rudy would be an Allstar in an open offense with floor spacers.

#13 southbluffsgrizzfan

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 06:15 PM

View PostTigerGrizzFan, on 02 November 2012 - 06:06 PM, said:

It's the spacing issue Marc and Zbo are ineffective in the paint against smart teams that adjust to us having no shooters in the 4th to keep them honest.

Ellington HAS to be aggressive offensively if not then move him for someone who will. But he can become that player so no need to panic yet.

Inside-out offense only works if you have an OUT as well. That's why tony Allen didn't get a lot of fourth quarter minutes last year. He kills spacing.

Teams like OKC MIA SPURs are able to score so many paint points by driving thru lane be ause they are teams that understand spacing.
Hamed Tony and even Zbo make it hard for us to score because there play style or lack of shooting allows the lanes to be clogged.

Only reason we score any points is because our front court forces turnovers and we run in transition. Rudy would be an Allstar in an open offense with floor spacers.

thank you TGF. You are correct when you describe the spacing problem. Last year after our playoff demise, I described it at "balance." But I am with you. Paint paint paint paint paint only works when you have somebody to keep the defense honest or you get the OKC series of 2 years ago where OKC simply put their bigs in the lane, clogged it up and said okay Grizzlies, if you can shoot it from the outside, you can win, but we dont think you can. And they were right.

Clippers did similarly last year with Reggie Evans and Kenyon Martin along with Blake and Deandre. They beat and banged down low and clogged the paint because they knew we had no other options.

Ellington, Conley, Rudy, Bayless et al have to make some shots or the paint paint, points in the paint, paint paint philosophy wont work.

I will go one step further and say that if Ellington or Conley has an open 3 that they can shoot in rhythum, I want them to try it. If they are missing it, then stop, but dont wait until there are 3 seconds left on the shot clock and then jack up a three.

I want our shooters to have confidence. Shoot the shot in rhythum, not force it late in a possession.

Also, I am in total agreement when you say teams like SA know how to space the floor. Last year, and most years for that matter under Pop, it was a beautiful thing to watch the Spurs and how they space the floor and then find the open man. I know they have the personnel to make it work but that coaching staff really knows how to teach their system of spacing and it is a thing of beauty to watch.

#14 GrizzTigerFan

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 11:25 PM

Warriors games shows what the issue has been with Marc and Zbo in the 4th quarter of games. SPACING. Because Conley and Ellington where able to hit the long ball it forced the Warriors offense to stay honest the whole game. So when 4th qtr came along Rudy Zbo and Marc where still able to attack the paint, which resulted in a win for us.

Tony is the "primary killer of space" right now but hopefully Ellington can offset him like Mayo used to do. Also Conley continued shooting success helps immensely as well.

#15 smit-tay griz

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 11:25 AM

I thought Marc performed very well in the fourth qtr last night. JMO

#16 scooter

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 04:54 PM

View PostTeddy.B, on 01 November 2012 - 07:56 PM, said:




Can't make any observations anymore on this board. As long as it's something even deemed to be negative one gets labeled a panic monkey or a hater.

I support the team, but I also state what's on my mind when I see things on the floor, but now all that happens is that it's easy to label someone this or that. When I say something or judge too quickly, I don't mind having a different perspective thrown my way. I can internalize it for myself.

Now though, one comment and you get called a Hater, Weak and Whatnot...........just classless posters. I'd rather not resort to attacking fellow posters. We are after all fans of the same team and want the team to do well why else we wasting time here.



Just because some people are less patient, less optimistic, even to the point of being more critical, it's still in the hope of the betterment of the team (at least in their eyes) no need to be judgmental. The 'ignore' button is there please use it!!

I want to state my observations without getting labeled/name-called whether you agree with me or not. You can however always retort and tell me your views, I welcome that.




Well said, Teddy. B

Edited by scooter, 03 November 2012 - 04:56 PM.


#17 KoufosSnozz

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 09:20 AM

We lost because they had Chris Paul. Even with old man knees, he still gets his team running like a well-oiled machine. If we could just get ZBo to turn into superman even just for a season, this team would be really dangerous this season with an improved Rudy and Conley. As for Gasol, I don't think anyone can fault him not scoring in the 4th quarter. The defense failed the team once again and the team just can't afford to have ZBo having so-so performances scoring wise when our defense fails.

#18 southbluffsgrizzfan

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Posted 04 November 2012 - 08:17 PM

View Postlilgregmonroe, on 04 November 2012 - 09:20 AM, said:

We lost because they had Chris Paul. Even with old man knees, he still gets his team running like a well-oiled machine. If we could just get ZBo to turn into superman even just for a season, this team would be really dangerous this season with an improved Rudy and Conley. As for Gasol, I don't think anyone can fault him not scoring in the 4th quarter. The defense failed the team once again and the team just can't afford to have ZBo having so-so performances scoring wise when our defense fails.
you know lilgreg, I hear you. I understand where you are coming from. But my point is simply this. Leave everything the same on the Clippers part. They made their shots. They hit their outside shots with Jamal C and CP drove the lane and hit his shots.

I believe we still could have withstood all of that just as it happened IF the Grizzlies could simply shoot 43-44% instead of 38%. Grizzlies, as was the case last year, had way too many empty possessions at the end of the game. The Grizz play hard defense at the end of the game. They would even force some misses. But when asked to simply hit a timely bucket--just a 2 pointer, more times than not, the Grizz just dont.

CP is CP. That is what he does and that is what he is going to do each time we see him in the future. Crawford is an assassin from the outside. That is what he does. All Memphis has to do is man up an hit a couple shots when its crunch time. Look at how many shots Mike C missed. Look at how many shots Zach missed, QPon was 0-4. Bayless was 1-6. There is the problem. Right there

#19 redeye

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Posted 05 November 2012 - 05:40 AM

I started to argue but Marc..............is a sorry ******* and we could get a 2nd round pick for him.Thank the gods we have Jason Levein because he can get us a 2nd and 5th rounder fort Marc

#20 GrizzTigerFan

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Posted 06 November 2012 - 08:45 AM

From Commercial Appeal

"Hollins has long been an advocate of running the offense through Gasol. The 7-footer is striking a good balance between making plays for himself and teammates."

I hope this is true, I think our offense would be the most fluid going thru Marc as well. Zbo and Rudy both are more prone to go iso and take bad shots than Marc is, and neither have his passing acumen or vision.

If marc averages 20pts a game then we will go very far this year. But it will be even more critical to get him rest and get his minutes down to 35 or less a game.