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GrizzTigerFan

Stat Check - Early Look at the Numbers

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Thanks for putting together all of the advanced stats, GrizzTigerFan. A pretty enlightened discussion actually happening here as a result. Keep it up all year, if you don't mind.

I think it's pretty obvious that Harrison isn't just awful individually, but he's killing the team. The issue to look for is whether Fizdale makes any changes to attempt to address that, by, as I mentioned in other thread, bringing his minutes down. He's getting 20 mpg right now. That needs to come down. The question is how it might be accomplished. 

Again, Selden and McLemore can't return soon enough.

 

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3 minutes ago, Holidayinn21 said:

Were you not one of the people on board with AH starting during the summer, all for the sake of playing Conley off-ball?

I'm glad you've finally seen the light, but this is why forcing the off the ball stuff was a bad idea: Taking the ball out of Mike's hands, and giving the ball to inferior players. Fiz should take notes on how the Warriors utilize Curry away from the ball.

Yes i was but keep in mind.   It's not simply playing Mike off the ball that's the problem  Its playing Harrison as the ball-handler that is.   Reke and Rio play excellently with Conley. 

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Harrison is in danger of falling completely out of the rotation once our other players get healthy. 

I do think that it is more of a rhythm thing than something more permanent, but he doesnt have the luxury of the benefit of doubt at this point.

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The advanced stats don't really like Mario Chalmers right now, either. You have to hope that his jumpshot returns to form, and hopefully soon.

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13 minutes ago, Herodotus said:

The advanced stats don't really like Mario Chalmers right now, either. You have to hope that his jumpshot returns to form, and hopefully soon.

That scary thing is that history shows its more likely not to. 

We all know players production falls off a cliff after rupturing their achilles. I was so shocked at how good he looked during preseason play. But, I wouldn't put money on him having an efficient season because of the long list of players who failed to do well the season after returning from that injury.

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4 minutes ago, Kevin B Moses said:

Harrison is in danger of falling completely out of the rotation once our other players get healthy. 

I do think that it is more of a rhythm thing than something more permanent, but he doesnt have the luxury of the benefit of doubt at this point.

 

I think most on here accept this, and right now, people need to compare Harrison to a 3rd string pt guard, even though he is starting, especially if both Benny Mac and Selden are meaningful contributors.

It will be interesting to see who else is out of the rotation once all guys are healthy, which likely really won't be too often give the Grizzlies and individual player histories.

But if all 15 players are healthy, does Martin see the floor once JaM returns or maybe it is Wright, or maybe it is matchup dependent?  Will both Selden and McLemore play or will one win out, and the other one sit next to Deyonta all game?

I think Fiz stays with a 10 man rotation for the  most part, but again, injuries will probably dictate this anyway

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6 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

Yes i was but keep in mind.   It's not simply playing Mike off the ball that's the problem  Its playing Harrison as the ball-handler that is.   Reke and Rio play excellently with Conley. 

Mike works well with pretty much anyone that plays the 2. I was open to Tyreke starting, but he has tunnel vision and will dribble the life out of the ball. He's fine off the bench.

This offense isn't very good right now. Since this is a numbers thread, here's a few: 52% of the baskets are assisted, down from 58 last year. Average seconds per touch:3.32, up from 2.87 last year. Shots coming off the screen, which was suppose to be a staple of Fiz's offense, and the main reason for Mike playing off the ball, is only being used a pathetic 1.7% of the time, way down from 6.1 last year.

It's basically isos with a lot of bricks, and it's no coincidence that Mike doesn't have the ball. Letting Mike run the show, with Ben , I would even take Selden at this point,at the 2,with ball/player movement, would do wonders for everyone.

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51 minutes ago, Holidayinn21 said:

one of the people on board with AH starting during the summer, all for the sake of playing Conley off-ball?

Just like people expect Reke to be something that he is not , I am convinced the same is true for Drew.

Keep in mind, for all intents and purposes he is just a second year player. Even Kobe Bryant wasn't exactly a superstar his first few years in the Association. It takes most player a number of years to really pull it all together.

 

1. Drew is not a PG.

2. He is not a shooting guard. {Semantics, but a SG is not necessarily the same as a 2G.}

3. There are five people on the court but only one ball.

 

The issue, at least in my uneducated view, is as a 2G, Drew should not serve as the primary  ballhandler, but should instead run as a secondary ballhandler, the role that Parson was originally slated to take in the starting lineup. That issue is also compounded by the lack of offensive firepower available at the moment.

 

In an ideal world (one where Ben is unfortunately unavailable), Parsons would start in the 3 position and JaM would take a step forward in turns of both pts and rebounding. I would still start Drew over Seldan just to have that third ballhandler on the court at all times. His role is not to facilitate the offense or to make plays. His role is to make sure that Conley is not abused on the defensive end, while also allowing Coley to run off screens and such, thus conserving his energy until the fourth quarter and when the game is on the line.

 

Not to mention, I would demand that he gets at least 4-5 fouls every game. Matter of fact, I could careless if he got pts or assists. I just want him out there racking up steal, deflections, and PFs.

Cause havoc!! 

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Sample size is too small to have any real opinion of what we have or don't have as a team. But I will take the small sample and give my opinion of it.

Harrison is awful. Chalmers is just as bad shooting but at least knows how to run the team, so we think he's good. If he doesn't improve soon, we will find ourselves in the same situation we always have- no backup pg.

I hate Tyreke's style of play. He dribbles too much and is very selfish. However he is playing well right now. Let's hope he stays healthy and productive. If he does, the team will tolerate it. He needs to stay with the bench unit though, where he can be the go to scorer and ball hog without as much complaining.

Dillon Brooks is a solid player. I'd start him over Harrison. I think Brooks can be a Courtney Lee- level, above average starter.

I want to see more from Parsons. Although I have been encouraged by the improved play. He will never live up to the contract. I just want him to be a contributor at this point.

Is this the year that Marc stops teasing us and remains aggressive all year? I surely hope so. He has looked amazing so far.

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29 minutes ago, lsugrizzfan said:

Is this the year that Marc stops teasing us and remains aggressive all year? I surely hope so. He has looked amazing so far.

25 points 10.8 rebounds is very impressive.  If he will double digit rebound and worry less about getting assists, you would never hear me complain about him.

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7 minutes ago, tmoneyinmphs said:

25 points 10.8 rebounds is very impressive.  If he will double digit rebound and worry less about getting assists, you would never hear me complain about him.

Im not really worried about stats, he is taking advantage of mismatches and not settling for jumpers. That is the key for him, imo, because teams will contest to test him with smaller players and comfortably switch on him until he consistently shows that wont work.

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I'm sure fizz and the coaches know about this Harrison is killing the team not only does his shooting sucks but he has no chemistry with the other 4 on both ends.

We need 1 of the 2 Injured guys to get healthy asap.

 

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Up to date Stats through 11 games

Parsons 109.9g    92.9defrtg  +17Net

Wright  104.3Ofrtg   93.2defrtg   +11.1Net

Rio    103.7Ofrtg       93.5defrtg    +10.2Net

Brooks   103.9Ofrtg     94defrtg   +9.9Net

Reke   104.2Ofrtg     98.2defrtg  +6.1.1Net

Ennis   106.4Orftg    102.4defrtg   +4.1Net

Mike   104.9Ofrtg    100.9defrtg    +4Net

Marc   103.6Ofrtg    102.2defrtg   +1.4Net

Jarell  101.4Ofrtg   104.7defrtg    -3.3Net

Drew   97Ofrtg    115.6defrtg    -18.6Net

 

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Lineup Advanced stats (11 games)

  • Rio + Brooks + Reke + Parsons + Gasol    21mins       106.8ofrtg    67.3defrtg     +39.4Net    104.55PACE
  • Rio + Mike+ Reke + Ennis + Wright            10mins        109.4ofrtg   74.6defrtg    +34.7Net    91.10PACE
  • Mike + Brooks + Ennis + Jarell + Marc       47mins    108.1ofrtg       83.9defrtg     +24.2Net  92.06PACE
  • Rio + Reke +Brooks + Parsons +Wright     67mins   107.1ofrtg     91.8defrtg      +15.3Net     100.95PACE
  • Mike + Reke + Ennis + Martin + Gasol       15mins    111.3ofrtg    105.1defrtg     +6.4Net     105.8PACE

Those are our top performing lineups.  Basically an 8 - man rotation.   Just think how much better these guys will be when we can replace Jarell with Jamychal and add another competent wing option.    

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I think we're bout to find out. Sounds like both Jam and Ben Mac will be in uniform on saturday. 

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Tyreke has been a lot better thsn i thought. His reputation was that of a ball hog loser, but when he is getting 15, 6, and 4 assists a game as he did a couple of years ago, that is production any way you look at it.

Tyreke is a poor mans harden for 3.3 million. Pelicans made a grave mistake getting rid of him. 

Tyreke, brow and boogie would have been a top 4 team in the west.

The grizzlies need to lock him down. Id given him 4 year/ 48 million contract.

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19 minutes ago, Kevin B Moses said:

Tyreke has been a lot better thsn i thought. His reputation was that of a ball hog loser, but when he is getting 15, 6, and 4 assists a game as he did a couple of years ago, that is production any way you look at it.

Tyreke is a poor mans harden for 3.3 million. Pelicans made a grave mistake getting rid of him. 

Tyreke, brow and boogie would have been a top 4 team in the west.

The grizzlies need to lock him down. Id given him 4 year/ 48 million contract.

They traded Tyreke and others for Boogie

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42 minutes ago, Kevin B Moses said:

Tyreke has been a lot better thsn i thought. His reputation was that of a ball hog loser, but when he is getting 15, 6, and 4 assists a game as he did a couple of years ago, that is production any way you look at it.

Tyreke is a poor mans harden for 3.3 million. Pelicans made a grave mistake getting rid of him. 

Tyreke, brow and boogie would have been a top 4 team in the west.

The grizzlies need to lock him down. Id given him 4 year/ 48 million contract.

Glad you are coming around on him.   It's insane at this point for fans to only criticize his shortcomings without taking into account how overwhelming his positives are.  

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20 minutes ago, Kevin B Moses said:

Oh, yeah. Thanks Dave Joerger. I see he is still playing for the home team.

I just hope that Ben is another former King that revitalizes his career in the Bluff city. 

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50 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

I just hope that Ben is another former King that revitalizes his career in the Bluff city. 

+ 1

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6 hours ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

Lineup Advanced stats (11 games)

  • Rio + Brooks + Reke + Parsons + Gasol    21mins       106.8ofrtg    67.3defrtg     +39.4Net    104.55PACE
  • Rio + Mike+ Reke + Ennis + Wright            10mins        109.4ofrtg   74.6defrtg    +34.7Net    91.10PACE
  • Mike + Brooks + Ennis + Jarell + Marc       47mins    108.1ofrtg       83.9defrtg     +24.2Net  92.06PACE
  • Rio + Reke +Brooks + Parsons +Wright     67mins   107.1ofrtg     91.8defrtg      +15.3Net     100.95PACE
  • Mike + Reke + Ennis + Martin + Gasol       15mins    111.3ofrtg    105.1defrtg     +6.4Net     105.8PACE

Those are our top performing lineups.  Basically an 8 - man rotation.   Just think how much better these guys will be when we can replace Jarell with Jamychal and add another competent wing option.    

Good stuff...interesting to look at.

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7 hours ago, Kevin B Moses said:

Tyreke has been a lot better thsn i thought. His reputation was that of a ball hog loser, but when he is getting 15, 6, and 4 assists a game as he did a couple of years ago, that is production any way you look at it.

Tyreke is a poor mans harden for 3.3 million. Pelicans made a grave mistake getting rid of him. 

Tyreke, brow and boogie would have been a top 4 team in the west.

The grizzlies need to lock him down. Id given him 4 year/ 48 million contract.

If Fiz can get Reke to keep his assists up 4-5 pg, while still scoring 15 or more, that is gonna translate to wins I'm sure of it

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I'd  like to see what the stats look on a Mike, Reke, Ennis, Parsons, Gsaol lineup looks like

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6 hours ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

I just hope that Ben is another former King that revitalizes his career in the Bluff city. 

Ive got hopes, he was looking real good for a short spell when he was getting PT and a good role, until George Karl jerked him around, then the ensuing FO chaos, then Dave J. Man the guy aint had a decent stable situation yet

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