PutARingOnIt#GrizzFan

I have to give Wallace his props..this team really has few flaw besides injury concerns

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23 hours ago, Kevin B Moses said:

LOL, the dude rated Memphis 28th out of 30 teams. Good Grief.

This is a futures power ranking for the next 3 years. It's not like he said anything that is controversial. 

 

Quote

How will your team perform the next three seasons?

The Future Power Rankings are ESPN Insider's projection of the on-court success expected for each team in the 2017-18, 2018-19 and 2019-20 seasons.

Consider this a convenient way to see the direction in which your favorite team is headed.

Each of the NBA's 30 teams received an overall Future Power Rating of 0 to 100 based on how well we expect each team to perform in the next three seasons.

 

To rank the 30 teams, we asked ESPN Insider analysts Kevin Pelton and Bobby Marks to rate each team in each category.

 

 

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On 9/20/2017 at 5:34 PM, smit-tay griz said:

I'm not lamenting the fact that we moved on from TA, Zbo, VC, and maybe Green.  I am just questioning the sanity of those who somehow think that after letting vets of their caliber go, to replace them with unproven, questionable second-round picks, undrafted players and vets rehabbing injury we will be just as good or better.

The idea is that McLemore,Parsons ,Tyreke + Chalmers are the "replacements" for those 3 guys not the unproven, questionable second round picks.  When healthy does anyone actually think "past their primes" TA, ZBo and VC are right now better players over the "in their prime" and healthy Mclemore, Reke, Parsons, and Chalmers?    

Before you all throw the injury shade at them remember last season was the first one VC has been fully healthy in 2yrs, TA missed the playoffs and significant time AGAIN, only Zbo gets a injury pass.  

So this is more apples to apples comparison than this false narrative of saying Grizz FO is looking for Wayne, DD, and Harrison to replace TA, VC, and Zbo.   

 

 

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7 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

The idea is that McLemore,Parsons ,Tyreke + Chalmers are the "replacements" for those 3 guys not the unproven, questionable second round picks.  When healthy does anyone actually think "past their primes" TA, ZBo and VC are right now better players over the "in their prime" and healthy Mclemore, Reke, Parsons, and Chalmers?    

Before you all throw the injury shade at them remember last season was the first one VC has been fully healthy in 2yrs, TA missed the playoffs and significant time AGAIN, only Zbo gets a injury pass.  

So this is more apples to apples comparison than this false narrative of saying Grizz FO is looking for Wayne, DD, and Harrison to replace TA, VC, and Zbo.   

 

 

It seems you didn't read my post very carefully.  Yes, TA missed the playoffs after playing in the 5th most regular season games of his career.  Guess what?  Mike, Marc, and Chalmers missed them the season prior and missed a more significant amount of time.  So what?  Players get injured.

We lost a great rebounder and inside post player and didn't replace what he brought.  There was no rebounding added, no inside play.  We lost an All-NBA defender and didn't replace what he brought either.  True, he added headaches with some of his crazy stuff, but I say he helped us win far more games than lose.  We added no top-notch defenders to replace what he brought.

Of all those vet replacements you mentioned I have more faith in Tyreke being able to perform than any of the others.  The addition of Parsons seems a fiasco to me.  He brings a more broken body than a 40 year old Vince Carter, and seemingly the opposite attitude.  I think the McLemore reclamation project is risky, and now he's injured too.  I loved what Chalmers brought when he was here before his injury.  I think he has been the best PG off the bench this team has ever had, but he's what? 31? and coming off an extremely difficult injury to return from.  His contract is not guaranteed (rightfully so in light of the facts) so he may get cut anyway in order to meet roster rules.  To top it off we traded our third best points per minute player remaining from last season.  A player with a lot of flaws, sure, but one who possessed the one skill this team has needed for years - shooting.

So, in summary, we lost rebounding, we lost inside post play, we lost defense, and we lost shooting.  We added maybe a little play making and scoring, but we have very limited methods to effectively score, and if we can't corral defensive rebounds we're going to have a very difficult time stopping the other team from scoring.  So, tell me how is the team better?

Like I stated before, I understand moving on from those guys.  I was going to happen sooner or later, but this upcoming season looks nearly like a tank job.  I hope I'm wrong.

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1 hour ago, smit-tay griz said:

It seems you didn't read my post very carefully.  Yes, TA missed the playoffs after playing in the 5th most regular season games of his career.  Guess what?  Mike, Marc, and Chalmers missed them the season prior and missed a more significant amount of time.  So what?  Players get injured.

We lost a great rebounder and inside post player and didn't replace what he brought.  There was no rebounding added, no inside play.  We lost an All-NBA defender and didn't replace what he brought either.  True, he added headaches with some of his crazy stuff, but I say he helped us win far more games than lose.  We added no top-notch defenders to replace what he brought.

Of all those vet replacements you mentioned I have more faith in Tyreke being able to perform than any of the others.  The addition of Parsons seems a fiasco to me.  He brings a more broken body than a 40 year old Vince Carter, and seemingly the opposite attitude.  I think the McLemore reclamation project is risky, and now he's injured too.  I loved what Chalmers brought when he was here before his injury.  I think he has been the best PG off the bench this team has ever had, but he's what? 31? and coming off an extremely difficult injury to return from.  His contract is not guaranteed (rightfully so in light of the facts) so he may get cut anyway in order to meet roster rules.  To top it off we traded our third best points per minute player remaining from last season.  A player with a lot of flaws, sure, but one who possessed the one skill this team has needed for years - shooting.

So, in summary, we lost rebounding, we lost inside post play, we lost defense, and we lost shooting.  We added maybe a little play making and scoring, but we have very limited methods to effectively score, and if we can't corral defensive rebounds we're going to have a very difficult time stopping the other team from scoring.  So, tell me how is the team better?

Like I stated before, I understand moving on from those guys.  I was going to happen sooner or later, but this upcoming season looks nearly like a tank job.  I hope I'm wrong.

I hope you are wrong too.

So if i understand correctly you are under the impression that we needed to replace those guys specific skillsets?   In other words you would have only been happy if we replaced Zbo with Al Jefferson, Tony with Michael Kidd-Gilcrist, Troy Daniels with Anthony Morrow, and Vince with Paul Pierce?  

However, I am basing my opinion on what the Coach says he actually wants.   He has stated that he wants a more switchable aggressive type team defense,  more playmaking and more scoring from the wings and a faster pace with more athleticism.  Overall he appears to like guys that are much more versatile and dynamic offensively.  

Out of VC, Zbo, TD, and TA only VC fits the type of offense Fizz wants to run but he is 40yrs old. On the other hand the new guys

Lets see which boxes the replacements check:

Parsons - faster pace, Scoring, shooting, playmaking, versatile

Tyreke - scoring, playmaking, versatile, and athleticism, switchable

Ben - shooting, athleticism, switchable

Chalmers - shooting, scoring, playmaking, 

Those guys check multiple boxes and are better fits for Fizz system.   

2 hours ago, smit-tay griz said:

So, in summary, we lost rebounding, we lost inside post play, we lost defense, and we lost shooting.  We added maybe a little play making and scoring, but we have very limited methods to effectively score, and if we can't corral defensive rebounds we're going to have a very difficult time stopping the other team from scoring.  So, tell me how is the team better?

You know why we needed to have elite defense and rebounding?  Because we had extremely limited method of scoring(low post or FTs) in the first place.   Low post scoring is not a more efficient way of scoring over 3pt shots or slashing to the rim.   If it was then why has the majority of the NBA moved AWAY from it?  That's always been a false narrative.   the team had to stop the other team from scoring because we couldn't freaking score or do you think we were always bottom of the league in scoring by choice?   BTW this team last season was just as good defensively when Tony was out so there is no reason to believe loss of his presence will destroy our defense.   Added playmaking by definition means it will be easier to effectively score because that's what playmakers do.

The problem was that keeping TA + ZBo on the team required the team to be a elite defense and rebounding team.  Yet TA + Zbo were no longer enough to make the team elite at defense or rebounding so that was a bad investment. 

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Smit tay might be right, it is starting to look a bit like a one season tank job. The FO may have a bet each way on this. If Chancun, Reke, Mac and Rio miss much time there's no way we will have a good W-L record in the west. If they all play 80% of games, we will probably be able to win enough games to get into PO.

I wonder how a tank job would go down with Marc?

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17 hours ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

I hope you are wrong too.

So if i understand correctly you are under the impression that we needed to replace those guys specific skillsets?   In other words you would have only been happy if we replaced Zbo with Al Jefferson, Tony with Michael Kidd-Gilcrist, Troy Daniels with Anthony Morrow, and Vince with Paul Pierce?  

However, I am basing my opinion on what the Coach says he actually wants.   He has stated that he wants a more switchable aggressive type team defense,  more playmaking and more scoring from the wings and a faster pace with more athleticism.  Overall he appears to like guys that are much more versatile and dynamic offensively.  

Out of VC, Zbo, TD, and TA only VC fits the type of offense Fizz wants to run but he is 40yrs old. On the other hand the new guys

Lets see which boxes the replacements check:

Parsons - faster pace, Scoring, shooting, playmaking, versatile  - can't play

Tyreke - scoring, playmaking, versatile, and athleticism, switchable  

Ben - shooting, athleticism, switchable  - has never shown good NBA ability, hurt

Chalmers - shooting, scoring, playmaking,  -  a huge question mark

Those guys check multiple boxes and are better fits for Fizz system.   

You know why we needed to have elite defense and rebounding?  Because we had extremely limited method of scoring(low post or FTs) in the first place.   Low post scoring is not a more efficient way of scoring over 3pt shots or slashing to the rim.   If it was then why has the majority of the NBA moved AWAY from it?  That's always been a false narrative.   the team had to stop the other team from scoring because we couldn't freaking score or do you think we were always bottom of the league in scoring by choice?   BTW this team last season was just as good defensively when Tony was out so there is no reason to believe loss of his presence will destroy our defense.   Added playmaking by definition means it will be easier to effectively score because that's what playmakers do.

The problem was that keeping TA + ZBo on the team required the team to be a elite defense and rebounding team.  Yet TA + Zbo were no longer enough to make the team elite at defense or rebounding so that was a bad investment. 

What happened?  When did KBM hack your account?  No, I didn't say anything like that.

Those guys don't check many boxes at all.  I'm still not sure about Evans, but I have some hope.

You value playmaking way too high.  Rebounding is a far more valuable skill.  Rebounding is about getting possession of the basketball.  You cannot make plays without the ball.  Your defense will stink and you will wear out your defenders if you cannot rebound on the defensive end.  How many poor rebounding teams win?

You are incorrect in your reasoning.  We needed elite defense and rebounding to be a winner.  Every team needs those two qualities to challenge.  True, we did not have the scoring options that some other teams have, but we embraced the ones we did and forced teams to play on our terms.  You seem to want to play the same style of basketball the rest of the league is trying to play, but unless you have equal quality players as the elite teams (which we do not) you will lose.  If you cannot compete with the elite at their own game, you have to make a different game and make your competitors uncomfortable and force them to play it.

One last thing.  If you read the title of this thread you will see that the idea is that there are few flaws in this team.  I will greatly dispute that foolish assumption.

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40 minutes ago, smit-tay griz said:

What happened?  When did KBM hack your account?  No, I didn't say anything like that.

Those guys don't check many boxes at all.  I'm still not sure about Evans, but I have some hope.

You value playmaking way too high.  Rebounding is a far more valuable skill.  Rebounding is about getting possession of the basketball.  You cannot make plays without the ball.  Your defense will stink and you will wear out your defenders if you cannot rebound on the defensive end.  How many poor rebounding teams win?

You are incorrect in your reasoning.  We needed elite defense and rebounding to be a winner.  Every team needs those two qualities to challenge.  True, we did not have the scoring options that some other teams have, but we embraced the ones we did and forced teams to play on our terms.  You seem to want to play the same style of basketball the rest of the league is trying to play, but unless you have equal quality players as the elite teams (which we do not) you will lose.  If you cannot compete with the elite at their own game, you have to make a different game and make your competitors uncomfortable and force them to play it.

One last thing.  If you read the title of this thread you will see that the idea is that there are few flaws in this team.  I will greatly dispute that foolish assumption.

LOL KBM didn't hack my account.  

Parsons and Tyreke are only 28yrs old and both have been cleared to play full contact in training camp.   Rio is more iffy due to his age (31) but  has been cleared for training camp too.   None of those guys were available for training camp last season.   Our roster has multiple legit ball-handlers (Parsons, Reke, Harrison) to help out Mike even if Rio is a no go. 

Why are people acting like Reke and Parsons were not high-level NBA players when healthy is beyond me.   Why are people acting like Reke and Parsons skillsets are not exactly what the team has been needing for years is beyond me.   Those two can ball and it has been PROVEN.   

Literally only doubt should be in the form of have they fully recovered from injury.  If VC can hobble for 2 years then be a legit contributor at age 40 then i believe Reke and Parsons will be just fine.    

Yes, Ben is injured but it isn't a career threatening injury and he is only 24yrs old.   Although he disappointed relative to being a lottery pick, last season he still would've been our 6th most productive player according to last years stats!  

1. Mike 2. Marc 3. Zbo 4. JaM 5. Tony 6 . Vince   7.Ennis      You think Ben wouldn't have been a top 8 player?  Ennis scored 6.7ppg in 23mpg while Ben scored 8.1ppg in 19mpg.      Fine McLemore hasn't overly impressed but that still doesn't mean he isn't one of the top talents on OUR team.  

You are incorrect in your objection to my reasoning.  No where in my statements did i say that we could not he an elite defense or good rebounding team.   I just pointed out that losing tony will not stop us from being a great defensive team.  I also do not know what your definition of a "winner" is.    If you are saying in order to win the championship we need elite defense then you are correct.  If you are saying just having a winning record then a team doesn't need an elite defense.  Most teams just need solid defense and a good offense to become a playoff team.    

Let me define Playmaker for you since you undervalue it so much.http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2690988-nba-metrics-101-the-best-playmakers-in-the-nba-according-to-the-numbers   "we'll define playmakers as those who can either create their own offense or help others score." 

Nowadays if we want to compete we need a more dynamic offense which is easier to accomplish with multiple playmakers.   As the playoffs has shown us for YEARS its too easy to stop a team that has only one true playmaker and only a couple of guys that can create their own shots.   Our roster NOW has 4 guys that have proven ability to create their own shots: Mike, Reke, Parsons and Rio.   Our roster also now has 5 guys that are proven threats to score big: Mike, Reke, Parsons, Rio and Gasol.   

I agree we may suffer in the rebounding department but i disagree that it will be a defining factor in our playoff chase.   We were 24th last year.  http://stats.nba.com/teams/traditional/?sort=REB&dir=-1   Bos was 27th, MIL was 29th, Tor was 18th, SAS was 11th.   

Den was 2nd, Chi was 3rd, Det was 4th so apparently all that awesome rebounding translated to playoff berths.  

 

I swear some of you all just want to whine and be pessimistic no matter what we do.   Personally speaking JaMychal, Parsons, Ben, Rio, and Tyreke, are EXACTLY the types of players skill and talent-wise that i wanted us to have on this team with the CORE for years.     Wayne, Davis, Rade, and Brooks are exactly the type of young players i wanted us to invest in from a talent standpoint.

The OP based made his evaluation with the stipulation of "injury concers".   On paper he is right - this is a much more versatile and athletic team capable of playing high-level offense AND defense. 

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19 hours ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

Lets see which boxes the replacements check:

Parsons - faster pace, Scoring, shooting, playmaking, versatile

Tyreke - scoring, playmaking, versatile, and athleticism, switchable

Ben - shooting, athleticism, switchable

Chalmers - shooting, scoring, playmaking, 

Those guys check multiple boxes and are better fits for Fizz system.   

Associating Parsons with faster pace after 3 knee surgeries is a stretch. Associating Tyreke with athleticism after his knee issues is a stretch. Associating Ben with switchable is a stretch. Associating Chalmers who has been out of the league for 18 months recovering from a torn achilles with shooting, scoring and playmaking is a stretch. 

These guys only check boxes if you want to blindly ignore their negatives. 

And no one is acting or pretending Tyreke and Parsons weren't elite athletes and high performing NBA players before their knee injuries. You are ignoring their injury history in your evaluation. 

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20 minutes ago, chipc3 said:

Associating Parsons with faster pace after 3 knee surgeries is a stretch. Associating Tyreke with athleticism after his knee issues is a stretch. Associating Ben with switchable is a stretch. Associating Chalmers who has been out of the league for 18 months recovering from a torn achilles with shooting, scoring and playmaking is a stretch. 

These guys only check boxes if you want to blindly ignore their negatives. 

And no one is acting or pretending Tyreke and Parsons weren't elite athletes and high performing NBA players before their knee injuries. You are ignoring their injury history in your evaluation. 

Faster pace doesn't require Parsons to be a Russell Westbrook level athlete.     Saying Tyreke who has always been athletic is not now even though he says he is fully healed from knee surgery is no longer athletic is a stretch.    Ben is athletic enough to guard PG's and SG's that means he is switchable.     

Do you know what shooting, scoring, and playmaking is?   No where did i write Parsons was an elite athlete.   

And you are in full sulk mode if you think Tyreke (rookie of the year) and Parsons (max contract) did not perform at high levels in the past. 

 

I am not ignoring anything about their injury history but i am keeping in mind that NBA players are supremely high level athletes with access to great medical technology.  I am taking a wait and see approach to their health.   Last season Parsons wasn't cleared to play in training camp so trepidation was understandable.   Now they are all playing full contact (except Ben) so i think smart move is to wait and see. 

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16 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

Faster pace doesn't require Parsons to be a Russell Westbrook level athlete.     Saying Tyreke who has always been athletic is not now even though he says he is fully healed from knee surgery is no longer athletic is a stretch.    Ben is athletic enough to guard PG's and SG's that means he is switchable.     

Do you know what shooting, scoring, and playmaking is?   No where did i write Parsons was an elite athlete.   

And you are in full sulk mode if you think Tyreke (rookie of the year) and Parsons (max contract) did not perform at high levels in the past. 

 

I am not ignoring anything about their injury history but i am keeping in mind that NBA players are supremely high level athletes with access to great medical technology.  I am taking a wait and see approach to their health.   Last season Parsons wasn't cleared to play in training camp so trepidation was understandable.   Now they are all playing full contact (except Ben) so i think smart move is to wait and see. 

I agree we should wait and see. That goes both ways.

I am not proclaiming Parsons is going to play at a faster pace this season. You are. I simply responded that it is a stretch to make that assumption. I am not proclaiming Evans will have the same athleticism he had before his knee surgeries. You are. I simply said it is a stretch to make that assumption after 3 surgeries. I didn't proclaim Ben McLemore was switchable. You did. I simply it was a stretch since he has only played one position his entire career. 

I am willing to wait and see if these things do occur but I am not calling out  others for believing that the recent past is more important than 3-4 years ago. You did. You are stretching your beliefs and ignoring the reality we have seen over the last two seasons.

I hope you are right and we will have to wait and see what the players look like starting on October 2. 
 

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12 minutes ago, chipc3 said:

I agree we should wait and see. That goes both ways.

I am not proclaiming Parsons is going to play at a faster pace this season. You are. I simply responded that it is a stretch to make that assumption. I am not proclaiming Evans will have the same athleticism he had before his knee surgeries. You are. I simply said it is a stretch to make that assumption after 3 surgeries. I didn't proclaim Ben McLemore was switchable. You did. I simply it was a stretch since he has only played one position his entire career. 

I am willing to wait and see if these things do occur but I am not calling out  others for believing that the recent past is more important than 3-4 years ago. You did. You are stretching your beliefs and ignoring the reality we have seen over the last two seasons.

I hope you are right and we will have to wait and see what the players look like starting on October 2. 
 

Parsons has played in faster paced offenses almost his entire career (HOU DAL).  How is it a stretch to say he will be able to again?

I didn't say Tyreke  will have the exact  same athleticism i said he is athletic.   

 Being able to guard more than one position is the definition of switchable.  I was only referring to defensive side.  Versatile is usually the term when it comes to being able to play different offensive positions.   Parsons and Tyreke have been the versatile players.

All i am saying to everyone is wait and see on the guys before proclaiming imminent doom and disaster.    I understand if you don't believe the  new guys can help even if they are healthy - that's a different argument.  I am saying basing everything completely on none of those guys are healthy is wrong when they are actually participating fully in camp. 

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Tyreke Evans was never exactly an above the rim player. He had quickness with the ball in his hands for his size, but as far as other aspects that you use athleticism for like running the floor, cutting, finishing, defense, etc...nah.

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1 minute ago, Dwash said:

Tyreke Evans was never exactly an above the rim player. He had quickness with the ball in his hands for his size, but as far as other aspects that you use athleticism for like running the floor, cutting, finishing, defense, etc...nah.

Does that disqualify him from being athletic tho?   I never said he was an elite level athlete.   Nothing prevents him from being a solid defender and able to play at the pace Fizdale wants.   

I'll just quote the coach 

http://www.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2017/08/29/grizzlies-believe-mario-chalmers-ben-mclemore-tyreke-evans-address-playmaking-and-speed/614268001/

The Grizzlies believe they have better athletes and playmakers on the perimeter in Mario Chalmers, Ben McLemore and Tyreke Evans.

“I think it fits perfect,” Fizdale said. “You throw Mike Conley in this mix and you’re talking about some big-time playmaking, shooting, ability to attack the basket, ability to play faster, more skilled. I’ve got guys now on the second side and often into the third situation that can make a play for me, no matter what time is on the clock.”

McLemore was the Grizzlies first summer acquisition followed by Evans and Chalmers. All three players were targeted for their versatility. Evans and McLemore can play both guard positions as well as small forward. Chalmers is a combo guard who helped the Grizzlies during the 2015-16 season before suffering an Achilles tear.

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17 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

Does that disqualify him from being athletic tho?   I never said he was an elite level athlete.   Nothing prevents him from being a solid defender and able to play at the pace Fizdale wants.   

I'll just quote the coach 

http://www.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2017/08/29/grizzlies-believe-mario-chalmers-ben-mclemore-tyreke-evans-address-playmaking-and-speed/614268001/

The Grizzlies believe they have better athletes and playmakers on the perimeter in Mario Chalmers, Ben McLemore and Tyreke Evans.

“I think it fits perfect,” Fizdale said. “You throw Mike Conley in this mix and you’re talking about some big-time playmaking, shooting, ability to attack the basket, ability to play faster, more skilled. I’ve got guys now on the second side and often into the third situation that can make a play for me, no matter what time is on the clock.”

McLemore was the Grizzlies first summer acquisition followed by Evans and Chalmers. All three players were targeted for their versatility. Evans and McLemore can play both guard positions as well as small forward. Chalmers is a combo guard who helped the Grizzlies during the 2015-16 season before suffering an Achilles tear.

He probably isnt much more "athletic" than a 39 year old Vince unless you have a different definition of athletic that I dont know about. Now if you want to say he has some playmaking ability which helps that is another story.

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17 minutes ago, Dwash said:

He probably isnt much more "athletic" than a 39 year old Vince unless you have a different definition of athletic that I dont know about. Now if you want to say he has some playmaking ability which helps that is another story.

Vince was a freak so that still doesn't disqualify him from being athletic B).

Regardless i haven't been spouting anywhere that Tyreke's athleticism was his greatest asset.   It is his playmaking, scoring and versatility that makes him a great fit in Fiz's system.  

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1 hour ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

Parsons has played in faster paced offenses almost his entire career (HOU DAL).  How is it a stretch to say he will be able to again?

I didn't say Tyreke  will have the exact  same athleticism i said he is athletic.   

 Being able to guard more than one position is the definition of switchable.  I was only referring to defensive side.  Versatile is usually the term when it comes to being able to play different offensive positions.   Parsons and Tyreke have been the versatile players.

All i am saying to everyone is wait and see on the guys before proclaiming imminent doom and disaster.    I understand if you don't believe the  new guys can help even if they are healthy - that's a different argument.  I am saying basing everything completely on none of those guys are healthy is wrong when they are actually participating fully in camp. 

Do you read what you write? Parsons has had 3 knee surgeries since playing uptempo in Dallas and Houston. After his 2nd knee surgery he was slow in every respect on the court. This isn't the Parsons who played 3 years ago. It is a stretch to suggest his surgeries aren't going to have an effect. He may overcome them but we will need to wait and see before making announcing he will be able to play uptempo since he couldn't last year. 

When a player has knee surgeries it takes away from his athleticism. That's why it is a stretch to say Tyreke is athletic now. He may be but we need to wait and see if that is the case. He wasn't that athletic last season with Sacramento or New Orleans. Teams could cut him off from the lane last year which is why he has worked so hard on his outside shot. 

Since McLemore has never played PG I don't see how you can make the determination that he can guard PGs in the league. In fact it was his lack of defense that contributed to his declining playing time there. also, McLemore has never played any position but shooting guard in the NBA so we don't know how he will perform in these roles. We have to wait and see. 

You say everyone has to wait and see before declaring gloom and doom. I say we also have to wait and see before proclaiming the rosiest of pictures which you pushed in response to Smit-Tay Grizz. You should be as open to others opinions as you wish us to be to yours. 

We need to wait and see just how good or bad things become. 

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58 minutes ago, chipc3 said:

Do you read what you write? Parsons has had 3 knee surgeries since playing uptempo in Dallas and Houston. After his 2nd knee surgery he was slow in every respect on the court. This isn't the Parsons who played 3 years ago. It is a stretch to suggest his surgeries aren't going to have an effect. He may overcome them but we will need to wait and see before making announcing he will be able to play uptempo since he couldn't last year. 

When a player has knee surgeries it takes away from his athleticism. That's why it is a stretch to say Tyreke is athletic now. He may be but we need to wait and see if that is the case. He wasn't that athletic last season with Sacramento or New Orleans. Teams could cut him off from the lane last year which is why he has worked so hard on his outside shot. 

Since McLemore has never played PG I don't see how you can make the determination that he can guard PGs in the league. In fact it was his lack of defense that contributed to his declining playing time there. also, McLemore has never played any position but shooting guard in the NBA so we don't know how he will perform in these roles. We have to wait and see. 

You say everyone has to wait and see before declaring gloom and doom. I say we also have to wait and see before proclaiming the rosiest of pictures which you pushed in response to Smit-Tay Grizz. You should be as open to others opinions as you wish us to be to yours. 

We need to wait and see just how good or bad things become. 

Yes wait and see approach is the only true solution.    

However you keep basing your entire argument around their athleticism when i only mentioned that as ONE of their qualities that makes them a good fit going forward.  Those two dudes don't completely depend on their athleticism to contribute on the court.  They aren't Deandre Jordan.   Ben McLemore is more dependent on his athleticism to make an impact but he still is a solid jump shooter. 

I'll quote Fizdale and WALLACE for you again.  Since you love to disagree with me and have a history of believing whatever Coaches and GM's say in regards to players. 

http://www.commercialappeal.com/story/sports/nba/grizzlies/2017/08/29/grizzlies-believe-mario-chalmers-ben-mclemore-tyreke-evans-address-playmaking-and-speed/614268001/

“I think it fits perfect,” Fizdale said. “You throw Mike Conley in this mix and you’re talking about some big-time playmaking, shooting, ability to attack the basket, ability to play faster, more skilled. I’ve got guys now on the second side and often into the third situation that can make a play for me, no matter what time is on the clock.”

McLemore was the Grizzlies first summer acquisition followed by Evans and Chalmers. All three players were targeted for their versatility. Evans and McLemore can play both guard positions as well as small forward. Chalmers is a combo guard who helped the Grizzlies during the 2015-16 season before suffering an Achilles tear.

“Mario is one of the best big-game, clutch shooters in basketball,” Wallace said.

Chalmers sat out last season while he recovered, but he has a relationship with Fizdale that dates to his rookie season with the Miami Heat.

“A lot of people say it’s career-ending,” Chalmers said of his injury.

He added: "It was only right that I gave (the Grizzlies) the first opportunity at a healthy me.” 

Wallace concurred.

“Tyreke is one of the most aggressive and potent perimeter players in the league,” Wallace said. “He can play both backcourt spots as well as small forward, and his shooting has improved significantly since he was starting with the Memphis Tigers in FedExForum.”

Until training camp begins late next month, the Grizzlies will be more focused on McLemore.

He underwent surgery in early August to repair a non-displaced fracture of the fifth metatarsal in his right foot. The injury occurred when McLemore landed on another player’s foot after driving to the basket during a pick-up game.

The Grizzlies don’t have buyer’s remorse.

“We were very excited to get him at the beginning of free agency in July,” Wallace said. “His 3-point shooting has increased by the year with the (Sacramento) Kings. He’s got tremendous athleticism and ability to score the basketball. In this day and age you can take all of the 3-point shooting you can get. He has a great deal of talent and potential to be gleaned as the final chapter in the Ben McLemore book hasn’t been written.”

 

Fizdale sounded happy with the Grizzlies makeover, saying the "front office really did a hell of a job in addressing some key issues for our team from the standpoint of speed, playmaking, shooting. I really think they hit the nail on the head with these guys.”

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I hope you are correct. If those who are concerned about the injury history are correct it will be a very disappointing season indeed. 

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11 minutes ago, chipc3 said:

I hope you are correct. If those who are concerned about the injury history are correct it will be a very disappointing season indeed. 

That's a fair assessment.   I think it's a better use of our collective energy wishing for the best over expecting/worrying about the worst.   

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41 minutes ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

That's a fair assessment.   I think it's a better use of our collective energy wishing for the best over expecting/worrying about the worst.   

When your absolutely best case scenario on the court for the next three years is a low seed and getting waxed by a powerhouse team in round one, then the best case scenario for the franchise becomes getting the best pick possible.

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14 minutes ago, Dwash said:

When your absolutely best case scenario on the court for the next three years is a low seed and getting waxed by a powerhouse team in round one, then the best case scenario for the franchise becomes getting the best pick possible.

Heck no!  I'd rather take my chances with making the playoffs.  Every team is an injury away from getting bounced out, always.  Even Golden State.  All it takes is the chips falling our way and we can sneak out of the first round.  As long as Marc and Mike are in their primes we will not be an easy out.

Drafting players in the lottery is not the way to go.  Look at Philadelphia, New Orleans, Orlando, Sacramento, and Brooklyn.  They perpetually suck.  I wouldn't trade places with any of those teams.  Draft picks suck because they are inexperienced and unless you get a Shaq or Lebron, they will not turn your program around.

You can add Minnesota to that list to.  If they did not get Thibs and trade for guys like Jimmy Butler they would not have any chance of making the playoffs. Drafting got the Timberwolves Karl Anthony-Towns, Rubio, Zach Lavine, Kris Dunn, and a whole lot of LOSING. Back to the lottery every year!  (while the Grizz make the playoffs every year) Getting Wiggins, the number one pick from Cleveland did nothing for them.

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1 hour ago, GrizzTigerFan said:

That's a fair assessment.   I think it's a better use of our collective energy wishing for the best over expecting/worrying about the worst.   

 

22 minutes ago, Dwash said:

When your absolutely best case scenario on the court for the next three years is a low seed and getting waxed by a powerhouse team in round one, then the best case scenario for the franchise becomes getting the best pick possible.

Wasn't it just a year or two ago people were crying about Joerger trying to reach the playoffs since the team couldn't compete with the elite in the West? Now that the team really can't compete with the best in the West the same people are talking about being optimistic about just making the playoffs. 

I will try and be consistent and say I want the team to win, make the playoffs and continue to improve. My seats cost too much to watch another cycle of losing like we have had in the past. 

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5 minutes ago, chipc3 said:

 

Wasn't it just a year or two ago people were crying about Joerger trying to reach the playoffs since the team couldn't compete with the elite in the West? Now that the team really can't compete with the best in the West the same people are talking about being optimistic about just making the playoffs. 

I will try and be consistent and say I want the team to win, make the playoffs and continue to improve. My seats cost too much to watch another cycle of losing like we have had in the past. 

I don't know how or why any "fan" would complain about the franchise winning and consistently making the playoffs.  Heck, they were legit contenders just a few seasons ago.  I think that window has passed, but if they are able to sustain winning while building for the next era props to the front office!

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1 minute ago, chipc3 said:

 

Wasn't it just a year or two ago people were crying about Joerger trying to reach the playoffs since the team couldn't compete with the elite in the West? Now that the team really can't compete with the best in the West the same people are talking about being optimistic about just making the playoffs. 

I will try and be consistent and say I want the team to win, make the playoffs and continue to improve. My seats cost too much to watch another cycle of losing like we have had in the past. 

Different circumstances - nothing is ever apples to apples like you tend to try to make it.  

Joerger was only thinking about the present while he overplayed his aging vets and forsaken his young players.    So winning maybe one game with that aging team playing an old style was basically meaningless.   That team couldn't compete with the best in the west 2yrs in a row as history showed. 

This season with the oldest guys being  Mike (30) Rio(31)Marc(33) and implementing new style of play while developing youngsters.  If we make the playoffs with our current team and situation that actually shows me a very promising future. 

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19 minutes ago, Michael D said:

I don't know how or why any "fan" would complain about the franchise winning and consistently making the playoffs.  Heck, they were legit contenders just a few seasons ago.  I think that window has passed, but if they are able to sustain winning while building for the next era props to the front office!

Couldn't agree more. 

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